After Market Battery Upgrade

[KevinC]

Our Next Energy (ONE) recently did a battery mod/upgrade on a Tesla and got it to go 750 miles in Michigan.
It's the first time I really heard of anyone pulling out the OEM batteries and swapping them but it got me to wondering how common this could become. I would imagine it would trash the warranty on something like a new Lightning. Maybe it offers hope that after a few years owning a lightning when the warranties about out , will we be able to give a car/truck a new life by adding in the latest battery and doubling the range, especially if battery prices have come down with future economies of scale.

Tesla actually designed their S model to be hot swappable, so it seems like it's something that you can at least get at. I Hope some car makers start to make an effort to dangle a path to upgradability since we're essentially driving big PC's with wheels now days. I think a Car should on average live longer than a PC and it seems difficult without a path to upgrade.

I'd love to know if anyone has noticed any car maker explicitly offering something like this. It would definitely persuade me to consider such an option.

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[sotek2345]

From what I understand some of this thinking went into the Lightning already with the battery designed for somewhat rapid swap out.

 

[SteffanG]

From what I understand some of this thinking went into the Lightning already with the battery designed for somewhat rapid swap out.

Yes, the battery is held up by 8 bolts (4 per side) which would make it a relatively easy swap out (with specialized equipment to hold up the battery)

 

[AmpedCanada]

So I guess I won't be able to put a bunch of spare batteries in the bed and plug them into the outlet back there....

 

[Bippers]

So I guess I won't be able to put a bunch of spare batteries in the bed and plug them into the outlet back there....

Not quite as easy but in the future when the truck is considered very old and the original batteries are toast I bet you could do that and swap the original battery location doing a DIY electric swap. This is similar to what people are doing converting ICE cars now. But plugging into the outlet is not the answer.

 

[snyce1]

Our Next Energy (ONE) recently did a battery mod/upgrade on a Tesla and got it to go 750 miles in Michigan.
It's the first time I really heard of anyone pulling out the OEM batteries and swapping them but it got me to wondering how common this could become. I would imagine it would trash the warranty on something like a new Lightning. Maybe it offers hope that after a few years owning a lightning when the warranties about out , will we be able to give a car/truck a new life by adding in the latest battery and doubling the range, especially if battery prices have come down with future economies of scale.

Tesla actually designed their S model to be hot swappable, so it seems like it's something that you can at least get at. I Hope some car makers start to make an effort to dangle a path to upgradability since we're essentially driving big PC's with wheels now days. I think a Car should on average live longer than a PC and it seems difficult without a path to upgrade.

I'd love to know if anyone has noticed any car maker explicitly offering something like this. It would definitely persuade me to consider such an option.

Great idea . Some engineers will come up with a design that allows the batteries to be exchanged as uograde . Better yet designs that permit stop switch out and get instant rsnge rather than charging .
This will take agreement on manufacturing partners on firmat /connections ...much like DICOM format for medical information systems . Envision a stop on a long trip to switch out batteries exchanged for fullnonez like propane exchange. These can be positioned at existing rest stops , filling stations .

 

[RickLightning]

Maybe it offers hope that after a few years owning a lightning when the warranties about out , will we be able to give a car/truck a new life by adding in the latest battery and doubling the range, especially if battery prices have come down with future economies of scale.

Note that the Lightning battery warranty is likely to be 8 years and 100,000 miles (like the Mach-E), and guarantee 70% capacity at that point (like the Mach-E).

 

[xtraman122]

Great idea . Some engineers will come up with a design that allows the batteries to be exchanged as uograde . Better yet designs that permit stop switch out and get instant rsnge rather than charging .
This will take agreement on manufacturing partners on firmat /connections ...much like DICOM format for medical information systems . Envision a stop on a long trip to switch out batteries exchanged for fullnonez like propane exchange. These can be positioned at existing rest stops , filling stations .

I can safely say I never thought I’d see DICOM mentioned on these forums ?

 

[Gros Ventre]

How the manufacturer specifies electrolyte purity will have much to do with battery longevity. Ford, in their Escape Hybrid which uses a NiMH battery, appears to have specified a very high purity of electrolyte. They had stocked up on batteries anticipating a certain failure rate. The reality is that failure rate was very, very small, and the Ford maintenance predictors were somewhat embarrassed... but the owners have had a very, very reliable Hybrid car...

 

[AgieF150]

I would like to add more batteries to my PB to get better mileage.

 

[ryan]

Not quite as easy but in the future when the truck is considered very old and the original batteries are toast I bet you could do that and swap the original battery location doing a DIY electric swap. This is similar to what people are doing converting ICE cars now. But plugging into the outlet is not the answer.

Imagine pulling around a 10,000 lb trailer that just has a giant battery cell with a wire hooked up under the bed and driving coast to coast on a single charge while still getting decent acceleration and turning.

 

[Pilot2022]

Note that the Lightning battery warranty is likely to be 8 years and 100,000 miles (like the Mach-E), and guarantee 70% capacity at that point (like the Mach-E).

So you can still get 230 miles x .7 x .8 = 128 miles. Assuming some degradation for cold weather, close to 100 miles. Good enough for most of my needs (and hope to get a 500-1000 mile swap to new batteries in 10 years

* 80% is for 10%-90% SOC.

 

[RickLightning]

So you can still get 230 miles x .7 x .8 = 128 miles. Assuming some degradation for cold weather, close to 100 miles. Good enough for most of my needs (and hope to get a 500-1000 mile swap to new batteries in 10 years

* 80% is for 10%-90% SOC.

Yes, your math is correct.

However, it's a worse case scenario.

For example, on the Mach-E, the extended battery is 98kWh in size, but Ford has only released 91kWh to the customer (was 88, recently upgraded). As battery life worsens, it's likely that Ford will release more of the battery to the customer.

In addition, charging to 90% is recommended to extend battery life (with 100% charges the night before a trip where you need the range). 10 years in, maybe you don't care as much, and you charge to 95% or 100%. And no harm in running down to 5% instead of 10%.

Lastly, 230 / 300 isn't fact yet. We may find the range is noticeably higher.

 

[midmack]

My understanding is that they built the battery to be in packs, so that if one pack fails, they can just replace that pack within the battery. Should save money after the warranty expires to help keep the range up. A Ford guy, works in the tech department - working on the app - Lightning interface, I spoke to even speculated that they may be able to swap it out with new tech in the future, such as with a solid state battery, although that would likely be price prohibitive.

 

[hhulseman]

Note that the Lightning battery warranty is likely to be 8 years and 100,000 miles (like the Mach-E), and guarantee 70% capacity at that point (like the Mach-E).

That's a legal requirement. All manufacturers must provide that warranty.

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