Lightning range fail

[Pioneer74]

Yesterday the app said it went into a deep sleep with 5% battery and zero range. Today it is showing zero percent battery.

Deep Sleep points to a problem with the LV battery.

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[Amps]

I topped of In Ogalala NE. The next charging station on my trip was in Cheyenne WY. A 1 station 25 KW charger that according to the reviews on the app may or may not even be working. So, the truck said it would make it to Wellington Colorado to a fast charger. I'm guessing most everyone else would have gone to Wellington. There are many examples of the truck going past zero miles of range anyways.

In my experience, a Harley dealer's 25 kW Chargepoint is dicey even on a good day. The only ones that I have used are non-networked, so you have to depend on Plugshare. I went to one that was sporadically reported broken, then reported fixed with a brand new cable. I got locked by the new charging cable to a charger that didn't ever negotiate to start charging. The manual release didn't work. It wasn't really locked, it was bonded to the CCS port by the new plastic in the hot sun.

Wyoming is even tougher than the charging deserts near me. I hope you get your truck back soon and that you are treated better than you have been to this point.

 

[Sklith]

My Y is a great car to drive but it isn't as convenient as ICE for a road trip. If you are coming from ICE to and EV and expecting no tradeoffs, you are going to be disappointed. Those days that you drove 800 miles had at least 3 stops at superchargers, which would have been 3 hours give or take. Same drive in an ICE vehicle would have been 15 minutes in fueling. Hopefully this tradeoff gap becomes smaller in the future.

2 stops. 30 minutes each. We stayed at hotels which supplied free electricity so we'd leave in the morning with a full battery. We lost no time vs ICE since our kids needed diaper changed, food, etc any way so waiting for the charge wasn't a factor.

 

[Sklith]

Did you trust that if the car told you it could make it to a charging station it would? I had the range to make it with 5 miles to spare. I had just drove 420 miles at 80 MPH. The truck knew what milage I was getting. It's not like I changed driving style. Actually, I did. I slowed down to 55 mph when it just started dropping miles of range in a couple hundred feet. There is some issue with the battery pack, I am sure. I would have been in my GT350, but the AC went out a couple days before my trip.

I trusted my car's prediction with a 5% margin for error.

 

[Theo1000]

In my experience, a Harley dealer's 25 kW Chargepoint is dicey even on a good day.

I second that. My local Harley 25kw is locked after 6 pm every day and on Sundays. Simply scratch Harley chargers off my charge plans.

I'm actually driving to Gillette in 2 weeks time and so I'm plotting my path through this charging desert. Not to be done on a whim for sure...

 

[Blue Lightning]

I have a Tesla Model Y long range AWD. It is a great commuter car, but I don't like it for road trips. Longest I have done is a 300 mile round trip in a day. Nearly all highway miles. Stated range for that car is north of 300 miles. Didn't get anywhere near that. I had to stop and charge a little on the way just to be able to make it back to a supercharger on the way back. I had planned those stops, so it wasn't a huge surprise. Road trips in an EV is very different than road trip in ICE, and will be for some time. I am fine with that.

I have the same car. IMO it's the best roadtrip car I've ever owned, but that may be due to the routes I drive are often up and down the I5 corridor, where it feels like there is a supercharger at every exit.

It definitely does require more forethought than a typical ICE roadtrip, but i enjoy that sort of planning stuff.

 

[Yellow Buddy]

Or the LVB was fine and then just went bad all of a sudden. LVB do that all the time for no rhyme or reason--in hybrids, ICE, or EV. The only difference is in an ICE car(at least those older) is the engine would be fine for awhile and you'd just lose all the accessories. It appears with hybrids/EVs the 12v takes some role in the driving aspect of things.

Or the LVB is fine and the DC : DC converter could be shot too. That could be an overheat condition, failed controller on the inverter, loose connection. Any number of things there.

The manual also details a number of situations where the HVB will not charge the LVB.

This sentence is also highly relevant in the service manual:
“The 12V battery needs to power modules and close the HV battery contactors upon key-on.

Basically the LVB controls the “ignition” and it won’t matter if the HVB has charge if the LVB is dead.

If your car has half a tank of gas, it still won’t start if your 12V battery is dead…That seems to fit very well with this situation.

 

[greenne]

Or the LVB is fine and the DC : DC converter could be shot too. That could be an overheat condition, failed controller on the inverter, loose connection. Any number of things there.

The manual also details a number of situations where the HVB will not charge the LVB.

This sentence is also highly relevant in the service manual:
“The 12V battery needs to power modules and close the HV battery contactors upon key-on.

Basically the LVB controls the “ignition” and it won’t matter if the HVB has charge if the LVB is dead.

If your car has half a tank of gas, it still won’t start if your 12V battery is dead…That seems to fit very well with this situation.

I agree. I trust the quality control on the LVB a lot less than the HVB. Good news is *IF* it is a LVB failure that *should be* an easy and quick fix.

 

[Woodypeoples]

I have the same car. IMO it's the best roadtrip car I've ever owned, but that may be due to the routes I drive are often up and down the I5 corridor, where it feels like there is a supercharger at every exit.

It definitely does require more forethought than a typical ICE roadtrip, but i enjoy that sort of planning stuff.

Yep. The Model Y is great. Autopilot has changed my outlook on my commute. Hoping I enjoy the Lightning as much. I don't really think about range that much because I am just using it for my daily commute. There are plenty of YouTube videos about people doing long road trips in a Tesla vs ICE. An 800 mile trip in a Tesla will add several hours to the trip. Some people don't mind that, but you have to be aware that it is a requirement. So, someone with a family that needs to make a stop every 200 miles wouldn't mind.

 

[Sharpster]

My bet is on a problem with the 12v battery. Its crazy, but it seems like the 12v battery "controls" things in Ford EVs. If the 12v goes bad you could have 100% in the High Voltage battery and it wouldn't start.

I had 2 Ford hybrids that were the same way..if the 12v battery goes dead its game over.

This is the same situation in my KIA SOUL EV. When that 12v takes a dump, it happens without warning. Cant open my charging door, cant close the contacters, cant unlock the doors to get to the hood release(except with physical key), can't initiate charging the traction battery. Dealer had to replace battery and claimed there was a software update to manage the LV battery better.

 

[Sklith]

Yep. The Model Y is great. Autopilot has changed my outlook on my commute. Hoping I enjoy the Lightning as much. I don't really think about range that much because I am just using it for my daily commute. There are plenty of YouTube videos about people doing long road trips in a Tesla vs ICE. An 800 mile trip in a Tesla will add several hours to the trip. Some people don't mind that, but you have to be aware that it is a requirement. So, someone with a family that needs to make a stop every 200 miles wouldn't mind.

Saying that charging in an 800 mile trip would add several hours is a bit much in my opinion. It only takes about 20 minutes to add 200 miles back into my Model 3.
Famed Bjorn Nyland does 1,000 km challenges in lots of EVs, and they're not far off an ICE car (Kia Ceed PHEV did it in 9 hours flat while a Model 3 Performance did it in 9:15).

 

[greenne]

Saying that charging in an 800 mile trip would add several hours is a bit much in my opinion. It only takes about 20 minutes to add 200 miles back into my Model 3.
Famed Bjorn Nyland does 1,000 km challenges in lots of EVs, and they're not far off an ICE car (Kia Ceed PHEV did it in 9 hours flat while a Model 3 Performance did it in 9:15).

To be fair 1000km is like 650mi, about 150mi(25% less distance). I agree its not hours but if you're driving 800mi in a day you're already looking at what 13hrs behind the wheel, spending 1.5-2hrs charging extra is not appealing at all.

It can be done sure, but the impact takes off the more you drive per day.

 

[Woodypeoples]

To be fair 1000km is like 650mi, about 150mi(25% less distance). I agree its not hours but if you're driving 800mi in a day you're already looking at what 13hrs behind the wheel, spending 1.5-2hrs charging extra is not appealing at all.

It can be done sure, but the impact takes off the more you drive per day.

You are right on. I haven't done a 800 mile trip in my Y. I have driven from KC to Denver several times in an ICE vehicle. That is 600 miles, and can do it in one stop without a ton of discomfort. I just entered that route into the Tesla app, and it lists 140 minutes of charging. That isn't anecdotal, that is fact. That extra time is fine for some, but it isn't comparable to required stops in an ICE. It is OK to admit that. I still love my EV, and can't wait for the Lightning. I am saying these things so that people coming over from an ICE understand that there is some tradeoffs. In most peoples daily lives, the range and time spent charging isn't going to be an issue.

 

[RickLightning]

The guy is not saying that at all. He is basically expressing that he disagrees with the people who suggested the cause was anything other than the high voltage battery. He posted a video as evidence the problem wasn't the LVB, but the video doesn't provide any evidence the problem was the high voltage battery as he believes.

His truck wouldn't start. The high voltage battery still had some charge left. The cause could have been due to something else. Time will tell. Look back at a the post from a Mach E owner who had the exact same scenario last week.

It was towed, and a dealer confirmed the problem was the low voltage battery.

The reason his truck failed and wouldn't let him use the last 10 miles of range is almost certainly not because the guess-o-meter was incorrect and overestimated range as he stated.

It likely failed due to a BMS problem or something else leading to a drained 12v battery.

No, the dealer confirmed that the LVB was bad. They haven't resolved the problem yet.

 

[Woodypeoples]

Just entered KC to Chicago to allow for all level 3 charges. 524 Miles with 70 minutes of charge. Better, but that would be 10-15 minute stop in ICE (assuming you go in to pee).

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