CSP-23B57 for High Voltage Battery Notice

[GDN]

What tracking is this?

@GoodSam has been collecting data - reference this post and his signature - https://www.f150lightningforum.com/...high-voltage-battery-notice.16683/post-369950

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[CluckFam7]

Thanks!

I can’t decide if this makes me feel more or less comfortable haha.

I do see your point most are 2022 builds, though there are a handful of mid 2023 builds. Also wonder how much of a lag there is though in this issue surfacing with more recent builds. Guess time will tell.

On the flip side the sheer number is a bit shocking….around 400 tracked in a variety of public forums; I’d think there’s prolly several times that untracked.

I really want to buy this truck but not sure that I can with this many battery issues.

 

[CluckFam7]

@Ford Motor Company Do you guys plan to release any updates on this? Like root cause and whether this has been addressed? How should prospective Buyers interpret the lack of information or update on this?

 

[TaxmanHog]

Don't let crowd paranoia sway you, there is a greater volume of unsung positive experiences.

 

[msadan]

This just in...the FSA 23B57 has been put on hold temporarily.

From what I understand it's just until they sort out the powertrain software and release an update.

Message in OASIS this morning:

I was scheduled to go to the dealer today to have them take care of 23B57, 23B70, and 23B50. Got a call from the service advisor this morning, he said that both 23B57 and 23B50 had been put on hold. They were able to take care of 23B70, the BMS replacement. This was the first I had heard about 23B50 being on hold.

 

[carys98]

Thank you, I will do that!

This one works great.

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[RickLightning]

Thanks!

I can’t decide if this makes me feel more or less comfortable haha.

I do see your point most are 2022 builds, though there are a handful of mid 2023 builds. Also wonder how much of a lag there is though in this issue surfacing with more recent builds. Guess time will tell.

On the flip side the sheer number is a bit shocking….around 400 tracked in a variety of public forums; I’d think there’s prolly several times that untracked.

I really want to buy this truck but not sure that I can with this many battery issues.

The estimate was 4% last year, from Ford. 4% is much higher than 400...

@Ford Motor Company Do you guys plan to release any updates on this? Like root cause and whether this has been addressed? How should prospective Buyers interpret the lack of information or update on this?

No, they won't do any of that.

 

[Mike G]

I was scheduled to go to the dealer today to have them take care of 23B57, 23B70, and 23B50. Got a call from the service advisor this morning, he said that both 23B57 and 23B50 had been put on hold. They were able to take care of 23B70, the BMS replacement. This was the first I had heard about 23B50 being on hold.

The BMS replacement (23B70) is a 10 minute sensor replacement requiring no programming at all (not even a BMS reset, strangely enough).

But both the 23B57 and 23B50 programs require the powertrain modules to be updated.

So they don't want anybody updating Lightning powertain modules until they have put out a set of revisions to address issues they are currently seeing in the field.

So after that new set of powertrain updates comes out they will knock out both the 23B57 and 23B50 programs by doing one powertrain update to fix both of the original issues that those programs were separately intended to address.

 

[bmwhitetx]

Pinpoint test completed, "array" on order (I asked for specifics). 2-3 weeks on parts.

So "array" is indeed the description of the battery module. I just got my truck back and here are the repair notes:

 

[Dolio]

Could they also be updating the BMS to help correct or fix the problem with software. Or maybe even mark a specific pouch bad and remove it from usage?

They could definitely change the cell voltage delta (high-low difference) such to allow for the truck to continue to be charged and driven. If they think it is safe to let the tolerance get a little bit further out of balance. This options seems completely plausible.

A BMS (Battery Management System) can be purely passive, or various levels of active. One active method is that the BMS can apply a resistive load to the individual cells with the highest voltage, so that it allows lower voltage cells to "catch up" and get back into balance. Another active method is that the BMS can apply more charge to an individual cell so to get it "caught up" and back into balance. None of these necessarily fix a weak cell that has less capacity than the others. But it can prolong the useful service life so long as the cells capacity is not so bad. The total capacity of the battery can only ever be as large as the weakest cell in the back. (Baring some advanced BMS tricks such as actively shunting power into the weak cell during a discharge, almost no BMS do this, AFAIK). This option might be possible, it could maybe be more aggressive with rebalancing capabilities?

There is no possible way to take a single cell (pouch) out of service via software. It is possible to build a battery that can do this, but no one has AFAIK. It is mechanically possible to do this, and the nuances depend very much on the cell dimensions. IE: Many small parallel cells (Like Tesla), versus one large high capacity cell (Like Ford & others). You can disconnect one faulty parallel cell, which just lowers that "block of cells" capacity. You could also remove/discharge/ short-out/ Jumper over a single high capacity cell which effectively skips is, but the BMS would freak out unless it knew this was happening.

 

[IdeaOfTheDayCom]

The first positive sign since March!

Until last night, my Ford App showed me that the battery was slowly losing power while it sat there, so the power went from 50% on March 25th to about 30%.

Last night the App showed me that the power was back to 50%, so they clearly charged it a bit. Then this morning, it recorded that they drove it about 3 miles.

The App says it's charging right now at a slow 5 kw AC charger and has been charging a total of one hour.

Hopefully this means they're done and are making sure it will take a charge without the Powertrain warning.

I miss my truck. I've got lots of plans that can't be done with the loaner SUV.

 

[Mike G]

The first positive sign since March!

Until last night, my Ford App showed me that the battery was slowly losing power while it sat there, so the power went from 50% on March 25th to about 30%.

Last night the App showed me that the power was back to 50%, so they clearly charged it a bit. Then this morning, it recorded that they drove it about 3 miles.

The App says it's charging right now at a slow 5 kw AC charger and has been charging a total of one hour.

Hopefully this means they're done and are making sure it will take a charge without the Powertrain warning.

I miss my truck. I've got lots of plans that can't be done with the loaner SUV.

Not sure that's gonna happen today.
Here's the VHA from today, where they simply reset the DTC:

Your truck still has 23B57 outstanding. I don't think the dealership can release the truck to you in the condition it's in. It would require them to fix whatever the battery imbalance is, and then update your powertrain software...which Ford has told dealerships not to do UFN. And to expect a solution in June.

 

[IdeaOfTheDayCom]

Not sure that's gonna happen today.
Here's the VHA from today, where they simply reset the DTC:

Your truck still has 23B57 outstanding. I don't think the dealership can release the truck to you in the condition it's in. It would require them to fix whatever the battery imbalance is, and then update your powertrain software...which Ford has told dealerships not to do UFN. And to expect a solution in June.

Thanks for the heads up. If they're going to take until June, the Lemon Law may be the best option.

 

[IdeaOfTheDayCom]

Well, they charged my truck, and as it stands right now, it's still plugged in.

 

[IdeaOfTheDayCom]

They just called to tell me it's finished.

Of course, according to @Mike G they didn't actually do any of the updates, so this story may continue if it throws another error in the near future because they claim they did the work and that it's completed.

Time will tell.

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