So...reserved 2 hours in...with reservation number...I'm assuming SOL on price protection?

[EVTruckGuy]

we were talking about an increase in price to MSRP and the overall net income of Ford’s entire business. We were talking about inflationary pressure vs profit motives. We even discussed the pricing of expeditions.

while the focus here is Lightning’s, we were discussing ford generally as well.

I see. The expedition is certainly not a low volume vehicle. My comment about lightning being low volume certainly doesn't apply to any other Ford vehicles. I wasn't intending my comment to apply to any other vehicles.

I think we're on the same page now.

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[ivan256]

I can't tell from your response what you are disagreeing with. I read your entire post and didn't see anything in your response related to the points I was making.

Are you disagreeing with the fact Ford could in theory raise the prices and still sell out for 2023? I think this is pretty evident at this point. There is still a huge waiting list. They could certainly raise MSRP even more if they wanted to.

Or are you disagreeing with my contention this would not be a wise strategy for Ford to implement? My point is that Ford could raise the MSRP even more, but I was disagreeing with prior posts stating this strategy would increase profit. I don't think it would increase profit at all in the long term if Ford had an excessive MSRP. They need to stay competitive with the MSRP in order to to sell hundreds of thousands per year.

What part is inaccurate?

I disagree that they could raise the price even more and still sell out.

Let's see how much waiting list is left when all the trucks available to the people waiting cost $90k. The line was for people expecting $50-60k trucks with a government discount. Not $90k without one.

 

[EVTruckGuy]

I disagree that they could raise the price even more and still sell out.

Let's see how much waiting list is left when all the trucks available to the people waiting cost $90k. The line was for people expecting $50-60k trucks with a government discount. Not $90k without one.

I see. Well... Maybe. There are still nearly 200k people waiting as well as a ton more people who missed the reservation deadline in 2021 and will reserve one once new reservations are taken.

I do agree though that many of those people wanted cheaper versions.

A lot of people, myself included, wanted the Lariat ER or Platinum from the start. We are not a small group of buyers.

 

[ivan256]

Most F-series sales are XLTs.

Maybe I'm wrong and there's 100k+ people out there willing to buy Lariat ER or higher priced electric trucks. But I'd be surprised. Look at how many of the higher end Teslas sell vs. the "cheap" ones.

If the speculation is correct and there are no Pros or XLTs available, I think they've priced the Lariats and Platinums exactly where the market can bear. Any higher and they'd have leftovers at a discount. They know what they're doing.

 

[EVTruckGuy]

Most F-series sales are XLTs.

Maybe I'm wrong and there's 100k+ people out there willing to buy Lariat ER or higher priced electric trucks. But I'd be surprised. Look at how many of the higher end Teslas sell vs. the "cheap" ones.

If the speculation is correct and there are no Pros or XLTs available, I think they've priced the Lariats and Platinums exactly where the market can bear. Any higher and they'd have leftovers at a discount. They know what they're doing.

The reservation tracker from this forum suggests the vast majority of people wanted Lariats or Platinums. 20 of the first 30 entries are Lariat or Platinum.

Here is the link to the full results.

 

[ivan256]

The reservation tracker from this forum suggests the vast majority of people wanted Lariats or Platinums. 20 of the first 31 entries are Lariat or Platinum. The spreadsheet doesn't give totals, but you can get a good idea of the trend.



Here is the link to the full results.

This is a forum full of enthusiasts. The vast majority of reservation holders aren't here.

Anyway. I don't think Ford is leaving money on the table. I think they did exactly what you are claiming they couldn't do. They made the price the maximum they could. And when that starts to hurt future sales they'll start offering discounts. Like always.

 

[EVTruckGuy]

This is a forum full of enthusiasts. The vast majority of reservation holders aren't here.

Anyway. I don't think Ford is leaving money on the table. I think they did exactly what you are claiming they couldn't do. They made the price the maximum they could. And when that starts to hurt future sales they'll start offering discounts. Like always.

Right... Enthusiasts... Aka the very people who reserved the first 200k Lightnings. This spreadsheet includes 200 samples of the type of person buying Lightnings in 2022 and 2023.

And it shows they mostly wanted Lariats and Platinums.

 

[ivan256]

Right... Enthusiasts... Aka the very people who reserved the first 200k Lightnings. This spreadsheet includes 200 samples of the type of person buying Lightnings in 2022 and 2023.

And it shows they mostly wanted Lariats and Platinums.

I don't think enthusiasts made up 200k reservations. I think the reservations were mostly people who saw $40k - $7.5k as the great deal it was. Even though it basically wasn't real. If Ford (or Tesla with the Cybertruck) came right out and said if you want full range it'll be $90k, there wouldn't be 200k reservations.

I know personally I had zero intention of reserving one of these trucks. I watched that presentation out of curiosity. And by the end I had my wallet out. But that truck they pitched essentially doesn't exist.

If we were talking about Pro ER trucks, then yeah. They could raise the MSRP quite a bit and have takers all day long.

Anyway, we'll find out.

 

[EVTruckGuy]

I don't think enthusiasts made up 200k reservations. I think the reservations were mostly people who saw $40k - $7.5k as the great deal it was. Even though it basically wasn't real. If Ford (or Tesla with the Cybertruck) came right out and said if you want full range it'll be $90k, there wouldn't be 200k reservations.

I know personally I had zero intention of reserving one of these trucks. I watched that presentation out of curiosity. And by the end I had my wallet out. But that truck they pitched essentially doesn't exist.

If we were talking about Pro ER trucks, then yeah. They could raise the MSRP quite a bit and have takers all day long.

Anyway, we'll find out.

You are actively ignoring the survey of the early reservation holders which completely contradicts your position here.

Are you trying hard to not believe the evidence here, or is it just coming natural? Either way your consistency in not believing data samples and unwillingness to acknowledge the reality here is impressive.

 

[rdr854]

The real question is-- what is Ford's "profit" off that Expedition Max(purchased in 2020 for $8k under sticker) vs a similar Expedition sold today at sticker. I'm guessing the delta isn't as large as it looks

I think the delta is advertising and customer/dealer incentive costs (what ever those figures might be). In that regard, I can remember getting up $5 or $6K in various incentives From Ford. On my last two Volvos, the incentive was almost $10K each.

 

[PV2EV]

Many of us wanted a Pro and could not get one, and chose not to extend, buying the lowest trim offered (Lariat for many).

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