Charging details... doing some pre-planning

[DadBald]

I'm pretty sure I'm going to spring for the extended battery. Current info says it comes with the 80A charger.

I have a 50A 240V subpanel in my garage for a woods shop that I was planning to use for EV charging - this was well before the Lightning was announced.

I'm also installing solar in the meantime, and playing around with my electric rate tariff options.

Questions:
1. Can you "dial down" the 80A charger to be used on a 50A circuit?
2. If no, would it be ill-advised to run the 48A charger on a 50A circuit? I thought I read somewhere that NEC recommends (or requires?) 80% capacity with respect to connected loads.
3. Does either the 80A or 48A charger allow any kind of "smart charging" on a schedule? I'd love to restrict charging times to midnight -6am on weekdays or any time on the weekends to make use of the cheapest electric rates.

Figured with some incomplete Lightning info out there, and the Mach-E as a reference, we might be able to piece together these answers. Thanks for any thoughts!

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[sotek2345]

You are correct on the 80% loading. An 80A EVSE would need a 100A circuit, and the 48A EVSE would need a 60A circuit. That said, you don't have to use the Ford units - many other are available for sale at lower current (and lower charge rate), that would fit off of your sub-panel.

As for the smart charging (i.e. time of day), I would be very surprised if the Lightning didn't offer this natively. But if not, lots of 3rd party EVSEs have that functionality.

Note: I you don't upgrade the wiring and use the 80A Ford EVSE, you won't be able to use the home power back up function.

 

[DadBald]

Yeah, I need to do some more research on the home backup power function. As of now I'm assuming a very expensive automatic transfer switch is needed. I already have a generator and long extension cables for sump pump, furnace, fridge, etc... I might just simply use the power outlets on the Lightning itself. It would be slick to have the single connection point but I'm really not sure it's worth thousands of dollars for the once per year use around here.

Thanks for your thoughts.

 

[Brian Head Yankee]

Can you carefully open your 50 amp panel and see what size wire is feeding that panel and what the sticker says inside that panel? Is it in conduit? distance from your meter panel? Is it a 50 amp panel, or a higher rated panel fed from a 50 amp breaker?

Let's determine if your 50 amp panel is wired with large enough wires to upgrade the panel. Or, upgrade the wire and panel if its not too far from your meter.

 

[DadBald]

I'm unsure of the panel rating, that never occurred to me. But it's limited for sure by the feeder breaker and wire. It's a 50A GFCI breaker and 6ga wire that I redirected from a hot tub that was removed. I would need to run new wire to upsize. It's on the opposite side of the house as theain panel too. Not impossible, but a bit of a pain, and big wire isn't cheap. I would probably feel comfortable doing it myself though.

 

[TRP]

The vehicle itself can charge whenever you program it too. Our Mach E is currently programmed to charge from 9pm-9am up to 90%. If we need 100% I just push a button in the phone app and it does it's thing. A smart charger (EVSE) is not necessary for this function.

A smart charger (EVSE) comes in handy if you want to see more info about the charging session or if your utility has a time of use plan

 

[TRP]

I'm unsure of the panel rating, that never occurred to me. But it's limited for sure by the feeder breaker and wire. It's a 50A GFCI breaker and 6ga wire that I redirected from a hot tub that was removed. I would need to run new wire to upsize. It's on the opposite side of the house as theain panel too. Not impossible, but a bit of a pain, and big wire isn't cheap. I would probably feel comfortable doing it myself though.

Yea, you would need to go to at least #4, if I remember right. I'd check that out first tho. You are right about cost, bigger is not cheaper

 

[Nick Gerteis]

I'm unsure of the panel rating, that never occurred to me. But it's limited for sure by the feeder breaker and wire. It's a 50A GFCI breaker and 6ga wire that I redirected from a hot tub that was removed. I would need to run new wire to upsize. It's on the opposite side of the house as theain panel too. Not impossible, but a bit of a pain, and big wire isn't cheap. I would probably feel comfortable doing it myself though.

Yeah, you can get a 40 amp EVSE on eBay for $400 and up. Probably already cheaper than rewiring.

 

[Brian Head Yankee]

I would charge at about 40 amps (half the capability of the charger) and see if you ever wake up in the morning with less than a full charge. If you find it happens often, upgrade your subpanel. It doesn't make sense to buy another charger for $400 when you can invest that money into a subpanel upgrade.

 

[DadBald]

I wasn't sure if I could swap them at time of purchase with the dealer. That's what I was thinking anyway.

So wait a minute, can you specify charging amperage at either the charger or the vehicle? If so then I'd definitely keep the 80A version with the intent of upgrading my feeder like you mentioned.

 

[TRP]

I wasn't sure if I could swap them at time of purchase with the dealer. That's what I was thinking anyway.

So wait a minute, can you specify charging amperage at either the charger or the vehicle? If so then I'd definitely keep the 80A version with the intent of upgrading my feeder like you mentioned.

Far as I know you cannot change the amperage at the vehicle. I bought a Grizzl-E, you can change it internally with a few dip switches, 40, 32, 24 and 16, depending on what you want.

The extended range models will come with the 80amp Fordcharger, the rest will come with.......shoot I forget......my mach E came with a 32amp. It will easily charge it up overnight. I got the grizzle so it would do it a bit faster and I can leave the 32amp one in the car for use on the road if necessary

 

[astricklin]

Yeah, you can get a 40 amp EVSE on eBay for $400 and up. Probably already cheaper than rewiring.

For the safety of your home please don't buy an evse off eBay. Go straight to the manufacturer or a reputable retailer and ensure the unit is UL or ETL listed, if not both.

 

[metroshot]

For the safety of your home please don't buy an evse off eBay. Go straight to the manufacturer or a reputable retailer and ensure the unit is UL or ETL listed, if not both.

EVSE bought from Amazon I have been using for 3 years now with ZERO issues and never had a problem since day 1 for my Honda Clarity PHEV:

The charger itself limits the current to the car by the onboard inverter.

When I get the Ford EV, I will be installing the 32 or 40A charger as it's a straightforward 240V circuit. I normally have my charger on a timer overnight when rates are lower.

As for the power backup, unless I get a solar PV panel installed w/ auto switching inverter & battery pack, I am not springing for the 80A option.

I'll run 10ga extension cords from the Ford to my house for essential items (lights, refrigerator)....

 

[DadBald]

Yup, my plan too. Reason for asking is the 80A charger appears to be included with the extended range battery, which Im highly considering for other reasons.

I'm also looking into solar PV, and it's worth pointing out that not all systems come with an automatic transfer switch. As a matter of fact, they add significant cost, and so most systems are installed without them. When the grid goes down, so does the solar power. IMO, it's not worth the high price tag for a few hours/days a year we might be without power, even with a solar PV system. The lightning with extension cords sounds like a win to me.

 

[adoublee]

A number of solar installers are wiring solar into a special collar installed at the utility electric meter. Similar situation when solar array is large and the installer does a "line side tap" where they tie to the wiring in your panel ahead of the main breaker. These two methods are fine for systems only capable of operating in sync with the grid. However, this means the solar is never available, in any circumstance, to the home when the main breaker is open/off position to isolate you from the grid. While solar cannot form a voltage and feed your house alone anyway, I highly recommend having your solar installer wire the output DOWNSTREAM of your main breaker. In this situation, the solar might still recognize voltage connected manually from the pro power onboard output and extend runtime or possibly even charge battery if home isn't using all the solar power.

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