Sponsored

vandy1981

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 21, 2021
Threads
62
Messages
1,509
Reaction score
2,481
Location
Tennessee
Vehicles
'19 Jaguar I-Pace, '22 Lightning Lariat ER
Occupation
Plumber
Simple, his mom doesn't want to be victimized by robinhood. Taking your hard earned money is stripping the most important freedom of all.
How will his mom be victimized by robinhood?
Sponsored

 

Sgt Beavis

Well-known member
First Name
Rick
Joined
May 20, 2021
Threads
5
Messages
246
Reaction score
220
Location
Colorado
Vehicles
2021 Wrangler Rubicon and 2018 Mini Cooper S Count
Occupation
overpaid computer nerd.
Early rumors are the $12,500 EV credit is in the framework--
https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/ev-tax-credit-increase-12500-biden-build-back-better/

Nothing set in stone but a good sign. As an aside-- everything I saw early indicated the credit would be a Point of sale rebate that was a refundable credit(i.e. you could claim it no matter what your tax liability). Also, no details on any income limits and/or MSRP limits.

Stay tuned...
Looks like the biggest change is that $2500 of additional credit is for vehicles built in the US while another $2500 is for union built vehicles in the US. So Tesla would be eligible for $10000 in credits while Ford would get $12500.

No mention if there is a price cap or income means testing. I'm hoping that means those are out.


UPDATE. This is not correct. The CNET article was wrong. There is a $5000 credit for domestically produced EVs that use a collective bargaining agreement. In other words, they must be unionized.
 
Last edited:

sotek2345

Well-known member
First Name
Tom
Joined
Jun 7, 2021
Threads
30
Messages
3,700
Reaction score
4,351
Location
Upstate NY
Vehicles
2022 Lightning Lariat ER, 2021 Mach-e GT
Occupation
Engineering Manager
Looks like the biggest change is that $2500 of additional credit is for vehicles built in the US while another $2500 is for union built vehicles in the US. So Tesla would be eligible for $10000 in credits while Ford would get $12500.

No mention if there is a price cap or income means testing. I'm hoping that means those are out.
Slight correction. The Ford lightning would be eligible for the full $12,500. The Mach-e would only be eligible for $7,500, so Ford will be a mixed bag. I wonder how much this will drive Ford and other OEMs to move production back to the US (very good result if it does).
 

Bippers

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 25, 2021
Threads
1
Messages
84
Reaction score
85
Location
MD
Vehicles
1965 Thunderbird 2014 Honda Accord
Occupation
Chemical Engineer
What are the chances Ford will now jack up the price?
I am betting they hold out on the released price for the first gen, but second gen lets them increase it with little to no pushback.
 

Sponsored

greenne

Well-known member
First Name
Nathan
Joined
Jul 13, 2021
Threads
27
Messages
1,894
Reaction score
2,306
Location
Niskayuna, NY
Vehicles
2022 Lightning (Ordered 6/19, delivered 10/28/22)
Slight correction. The Ford lightning would be eligible for the full $12,500. The Mach-e would only be eligible for $7,500, so Ford will be a mixed bag. I wonder how much this will drive Ford and other OEMs to move production back to the US (very good result if it does).
Not gonna lie...I was a bit upset that Ford is reportedly going to build the EV Explorer in Mexico at the same plant as the Mach E. I'm like WTF Ford....build it at a plant in the US!!
 

fitek

Well-known member
First Name
Peter
Joined
Aug 17, 2021
Threads
9
Messages
145
Reaction score
73
Location
Washington state
Vehicles
Ford Transit 350EXT
They're a big business, they're going to build the plant wherever the numbers work out best. Maybe $2,500 sways them to build other EVs in the USA.

Tesla has many other reasons for keeping mfg in the country. Their customers aren't all that cost conscious, either, and they have a massive (I would say ludicrous) valuation, so investors probably aren't beating on them hard to keep costs down.
 

PungoteagueDave

Well-known member
First Name
Dave
Joined
Feb 20, 2021
Threads
3
Messages
963
Reaction score
900
Location
33435
Vehicles
Tesla MX, Porsche C4S, Ford F-350 KR, Ford F-150 K
Occupation
retired
What about tax credits for other things that aren't green? Are those immoral, too?
Yes. Moral hazards with unintended consequences and mostly bad outcomes. Yes, I am an economist. Opinions vary but I can support mine with facts.
 

PungoteagueDave

Well-known member
First Name
Dave
Joined
Feb 20, 2021
Threads
3
Messages
963
Reaction score
900
Location
33435
Vehicles
Tesla MX, Porsche C4S, Ford F-350 KR, Ford F-150 K
Occupation
retired
tax credits for oil companies are the best. Baseball teams and Amazon too. Corporations should get tax credits not individual taxpayers. (Sarcasm)
mythology abounds
 

Sgt Beavis

Well-known member
First Name
Rick
Joined
May 20, 2021
Threads
5
Messages
246
Reaction score
220
Location
Colorado
Vehicles
2021 Wrangler Rubicon and 2018 Mini Cooper S Count
Occupation
overpaid computer nerd.
Slight correction. The Ford lightning would be eligible for the full $12,500. The Mach-e would only be eligible for $7,500, so Ford will be a mixed bag. I wonder how much this will drive Ford and other OEMs to move production back to the US (very good result if it does).

Yes, you are correct. Thank you.
 

Sponsored

fitek

Well-known member
First Name
Peter
Joined
Aug 17, 2021
Threads
9
Messages
145
Reaction score
73
Location
Washington state
Vehicles
Ford Transit 350EXT
Also, I just jumped on this thread starting at the end and await the fulfillment of Godwin's Law.

I'll start my timer...
 

PungoteagueDave

Well-known member
First Name
Dave
Joined
Feb 20, 2021
Threads
3
Messages
963
Reaction score
900
Location
33435
Vehicles
Tesla MX, Porsche C4S, Ford F-350 KR, Ford F-150 K
Occupation
retired
And Virginia has an annual surtax on EVs and fuel efficient vehicles. The excuse is that they need to offset the lost revenue from the gas tax.
it isn't an excuse. It is a reason. A valid one at that.
 

PungoteagueDave

Well-known member
First Name
Dave
Joined
Feb 20, 2021
Threads
3
Messages
963
Reaction score
900
Location
33435
Vehicles
Tesla MX, Porsche C4S, Ford F-350 KR, Ford F-150 K
Occupation
retired
They can when you have an economy that works for the richest 1% and screws everyone else. You can when the CEO to worker pay ratio is 351 to 1 (in 2020..up from 69 to 1 in 1989).
the smallest ship in the sea has risen in the U.S. I suggest you focus on averages, not the tails. We have virtually wiped out poverty worldwide in the past 30 years. Not eliminated, but by more than 80%. Wealth came for a reason and jealousy and class warfare is absurd. Taking 100% of the wealth of the billionaires in this country would fund the government for less than eight months.
 

astricklin

Well-known member
First Name
Andrew
Joined
May 24, 2021
Threads
7
Messages
1,578
Reaction score
1,488
Location
Dallas
Vehicles
99 Mercury mountaineer
Slight correction. The Ford lightning would be eligible for the full $12,500. The Mach-e would only be eligible for $7,500, so Ford will be a mixed bag. I wonder how much this will drive Ford and other OEMs to move production back to the US (very good result if it does).
Honestly, probably not a lot. Companies have to plan these sorts of things for years and have the plans last for decades. They can't and aren't going to spend billions of dollars based on a policy that could change in 2 to 4 years time.
Sponsored

 
 





Top