Farley: F-150 Lightning production will increase to 150K units in the next year and receive chips priority

[vandy1981]

(example) Would many people choose a Model Y over an EV version of a Toyota Rav4 or a CrV EV if it were available?

The bZ4X is essentially an electric Rav4, so we'll find out!

Sponsored

 

[greenne]

The bZ4X is essentially an electric Rav4, so we'll find out!

Not quite. BZ4X is already years behind in technology before it hits the market. I'm wondering if its just a halfway effort to gauge consumer demand. Styling/size wise its closer to a Venza.

 

[FordLightningMan]

Tesla holds a niche with its performance. I own a M3P and it's a blast to drive. As long as Tesla continues to compete in the upscale/luxury class, they will do just fine. The question is how much more can they grow with only $50k+ offerings? The CT will allow for more growth since it's a new vehicle type, it's launch timing is actually pretty smart.

Now what if Tesla wants to triple current production? This means making a vehicle that's $15k-$20k less than they make now. How will Tesla do in this space? Who knows.

Also what about batteries? Tesla is more hands on in this component than any other automaker, it could be their next key to success.

The reason I want a Lightning is there's no other normal EV truck out there. Ford is doing a great job filling a need. Tesla does the same. Both companies look great to me.

 

[Kev12345]

its all about who has the batteries. GM & Ford can build as many variations of the SUV as they like but if they don't have batteries they have nothing to sell. Tesla has a massive head start in the battery department so I wouldn't underestimate them.

 

[Mr. Flibble]

I can hear a million Stans crying, "Just wait until the Cybertruck becomes the best selling truck be the end of the decade!"

I've already seen that on Twitter once or twice today. I do not understand the cult.

People want to believe in something. They like getting addicted to it. It takes a large amount of mental effort to be able to step back and evaluate things critically, and most importantly, be capable enough of self examination to realize when you are wrong, and change your mind and opinions.

Sadly, most people simply cannot do this.

 

[maverick92]

its all about who has the batteries. GM & Ford can build as many variations of the SUV as they like but if they don't have batteries they have nothing to sell. Tesla has a massive head start in the battery department so I wouldn't underestimate them.

This. If people think the current chip shortage is bad, just wait til the real supply chain crunch hits battery supply. People also forget how high Tesla's margins are on their current vehicles and they will only get better as they ramp their in-house 4680 cell production.

 

[greenne]

Tesla holds a niche with its performance. I own a M3P and it's a blast to drive. As long as Tesla continues to compete in the upscale/luxury class, they will do just fine. The question is how much more can they grow with only $50k+ offerings? The CT will allow for more growth since it's a new vehicle type, it's launch timing is actually pretty smart.

Now what if Tesla wants to triple current production? This means making a vehicle that's $15k-$20k less than they make now. How will Tesla do in this space? Who knows.

Also what about batteries? Tesla is more hands on in this component than any other automaker, it could be their next key to success.

The reason I want a Lightning is there's no other normal EV truck out there. Ford is doing a great job filling a need. Tesla does the same. Both companies look great to me.

Tesla checks the performance mark, but they also check the luxury market. I wonder how much Lucid, BMW and Mercedes will eat into the luxury market share.

 

[greenne]

People want to believe in something. They like getting addicted to it. It takes a large amount of mental effort to be able to step back and evaluate things critically, and most importantly, be capable enough of self examination to realize when you are wrong, and change your mind and opinions.

Sadly, most people simply cannot do this.

I also think there is a strong sense of being unique, even better than your common man. I used to think BMW had the most stuck up drivers.. now its Tesla. Not all.. but a fair amount of Tesla owners are like "look what I got" and that played great when it was an expensive playtoy that was electric when no one else was electric. Now with BMW, Mercedes, and Audi on the playing field I think that uniqueness factor will die down.

I'd never buy a Tesla for a myriad of reasons, but I can admit that up until now they made the best EV powertrain hands down. (They probably still do). The supercharger was genius. Its just the vehicle surrounding the powertrain I had a problem with and if you take away the luster of bonkers acceleration and EV inherent attributes(instant torque, smooth transmission, etc) a Tesla really does not compare to rivals at the same price point. Thats just my opinion...I think there are now better options out there that weren't available even 2 years ago.

 

[TF1000]

I used to think BMW had the most stuck up drivers.. now its Tesla.

A "Study" (small sample size) showed that BMW and EV drivers scored the highest on a Psychopathic Traits test. Think the EV drivers owned a Tesla?

 

[beatle]

Tesla checks the performance mark, but they also check the luxury market. I wonder how much Lucid, BMW and Mercedes will eat into the luxury market share.

Model S/X sales are already declining, but 3/Y is exploding:

In 2021, Tesla produced 930,422 electric cars and delivered 936,222. It's a new record.

• Total production: 930,422 (up 82.5% year-over-year)
  • Model 3/Y production: 906,032 (up 99% year-over-year)
  • Model S/X production: 24,390 (down 56% year-over-year)
• Total deliveries: 936,222 (up 87.4% year-over-year)
  • Model 3/Y deliveries: 911,242 (up 106% year-over-year)
  • Model S/X deliveries: 24,980 (down 56% year-over-year)

Porsche, Audi, and Jaguar also have EVs, though the Jaguar iPace sales are already declining. The e-tron is increasing slowly but still only has 19k vehicles over 3 years. Porsche sold 41,296 Taycans or about 13.5% of their total sales volume.

I used to think BMW had the most stuck up drivers.. now its Tesla. Not all.. but a fair amount of Tesla owners are like "look what I got" and that played great when it was an expensive playtoy that was electric when no one else was electric.

Stay out of my diary! I sadly never owned an M Roadster because I didn't want to be labeled as a douche. When I bought my Model S in 10/2019 I had no idea what the owners were like. They definitely think they've figured out life by "saving the planet" and the car "paying for itself" by not filling up with gas. Both of these statements have shreds of truth inside, but you'd think it was 100% the way some Tesla owners talk. It's kind of shocking seeing someone change after they buy a car. Not all Tesla owners are that way, but a disproportionate number seem to be.

 

[Mr. Flibble]

I'd never buy a Tesla for a myriad of reasons, but I can admit that up until now they made the best EV powertrain hands down. (They probably still do). The supercharger was genius. Its just the vehicle surrounding the powertrain I had a problem with and if you take away the luster of bonkers acceleration and EV inherent attributes(instant torque, smooth transmission, etc) a Tesla really does not compare to rivals at the same price point. Thats just my opinion...I think there are now better options out there that weren't available even 2 years ago.

Agreed.

There are a whole bunch of things Tesla does right. Engineering? Top-notch. The way they choose to build out their cars, and all the foresight into proper engineering is great. Superchargers? Great again. Vertical integration? Probably the best around right now.

Then you come to the software and self driving. Musk has been touting this for 10 years now, and it still isn't here. The entire design philosophy around the interior of Teslas is oriented to turning the car into couch with a big screen TV - which is fine - but you have to take your eyes off the road to go 3 menus deep to turn on the wipers or whatnot. They changed the steering wheel to be a "yoke", so it would look more like an airplane, the self driving is called "autopilot". Its a car, not a plane, yokes have a very specific purpose, so do steering wheels. The entire design assumes that the car is driving for you, and you are just on your couch controlling a TV.

Thats not how cars work. Not yet anyways, and not for the foreseeable future.

To be honest, the design is actually to save money, but it is touted as the future for selling points.

Then there is the actual viability of TSLA as a stock. The PE ratio is totally out of whack. Musk is able to do a lot of market changing things because of the over valuation of the stock. At some point, it will have to come back down to earth. I don't know when that will be, but it will be very hard for Tesla when that happens to be sure.

 

[Amps]

With a fairly limited investment,Tesla is well-positioned to be the Exxon Mobil of fast charging.

 

[jazzmanmonty]

The big advantage Tesla still has is they expand their charging network as demand for their cars increases. The same can't be said about every other manufacturer. Once Ford, GM, VW, Hyundai and KIA start selling hundreds of thousands of EVs every year, the lines at EA chargers are going to be ridiculous.

Like they say, "During a gold rush, sell shovels and pick axes." I wouldn't be surprised if Tesla/Musk didn't start evolving from a car company into a power company, turning Musk into an Energy sector giant.

All the comments about the ton's of EVs coming to market that are gonna wipe out Tesla because they don't have a huge lineup of cars.. b.s. Car companies have gotten into trouble in the past by having too many models in their lineup. Musk is smart by keeping it to one of each body style. You don't need 4 good sedans to be successful. Just make one good one and be done. One thing Tesla does have to do is start evolving the design of the model 3 and S like yesterday. The look is getting boring. Model S looks the same as when it first launched. Give it a new look!

 

[greenne]

Then you come to the software and self driving. Musk has been touting this for 10 years now, and it still isn't here. The entire design philosophy around the interior of Teslas is oriented to turning the car into couch with a big screen TV - which is fine - but you have to take your eyes off the road to go 3 menus deep to turn on the wipers or whatnot. They changed the steering wheel to be a "yoke", so it would look more like an airplane, the self driving is called "autopilot". Its a car, not a plane, yokes have a very specific purpose, so do steering wheels. The entire design assumes that the car is driving for you, and you are just on your couch controlling a TV.

Not to turn this into an Elon rant..but safety is a huge issue for me. I have real problems with Elon's attitude towards safety. More specifically how safety takes a back seat to his ego.

No automaker is perfect, but Tesla consistently oversells its autopilot in advertising and engineering. Optical Camera only is not the most safe option. Calling a system "autopilot"(and continuing to call it autopilot after many have said it causes confusion) is reckless. Having the general public beta test FSD on roads is beyond reckless. Worse, safety systems such as eye monitoring, seat weight sensors, are inadequate. The steering wheel system(detecting hands on) is easily defeated by a youtube video and a couple of soda cans tied to the wheel.

At least Ford and GM are VERY explicit in saying driver interaction is needed. They are very careful in how they market their system and the naming convention they use. Continuing to use autopilot terminology can be confusing and deceiving if you don't know any better.

To close, when Tesla has had high profile cases of people falling asleep at the wheel, sitting the backseat with autopilot engaged, etc. Have you ever heard of this with Blue Cruise, super cruise, etc?

And don't get me started on the center screen..that just seems like a huge distraction.

 

[FlasherZ]

It's very clear that many of you have never driven a Tesla before and are parroting many of the things brought up by other people who have never driven a Tesla before. There is a lot of financial interest in Tesla, on both the long and short sides. Full disclosure: I have no direct financial interest in the company, except for customer service / being a customer - so I have had no need to pump them up or knock them down.

I have my dislikes of the platform, and I think the whole "car determines your intent" thing needs a LOT of fine-tuning, but after 350,000 miles in Tesla S & X, I can honestly say that I really don't miss anything from a more "traditional" car. Model 3 & Y have introduced a few weirdnesses by eliminating some of the traditional controls, but you can get used to them.

The center screen is not a distraction. For manufacturing efficiency, Saturn Ion cars used to use a center instrument cluster that could be turned to face LHD or RHD. My mom had one of these and got used to that as well. It beats the hell out of trying to make BMW's xDrive or iDrive work (got one of those as a rental once, yikes). A lot of thought has gone into the Tesla software to make it workable (although I do dislike that they have some people who rather like to re-engineer the interface too often).

Tesla has been clear with autopilot since the moment that it was introduced that the driver must pay attention. It's on the screen with EVERY engagement. It requires you to have your hands on the wheel (and there was only a period of about 2-3 weeks where it didn't, until some stupid human decided to climb in the back seat and watch his car drive 90 mph down a highway). Then there are the people who tied canned-goods to the steering wheel to make it think hands were on it. But that's human behavior: we're already seeing where people are figuring out how to defeat other automakers' attention-watching mechanisms - and I'm sure there will be people working to defeat SuperCruise, BlueCruise, Whateverpilot, or any other marketing name chosen by a manufacturer. It's just that Tesla was first in doing anything more than warning the user when they were about to cross a lane line.

I'm on the FSD beta in my car, and it does a reasonable job in assisting with driving. It's not truly full self driving, but it comes close in certain conditions. I'd rather Elon push the boundaries in a controlled fashion than have the government be ultra-conservative.

I'm far from Tesla's biggest fanboy, but let's be fair. It is a revolutionary automobile and I have no reservations against jumping in our Model X and driving anywhere today, right now. I can't wait until other manufacturers take development that seriously - because for the past 30 years, innovation in cars has been limited to more cupholders in the back seat.

I want Ford to be right up there, and I think Ford has the right attitude. They're no longer sitting on the sidelines, they're in the thick of it. Let's go Lightning!

Sponsored