Circle K charging station experience by Out of Spec Kyle

[carys98]

The issue with gas stations as currently designed is most want you in there for 5 minutes. Assuming there's no major change in charging technology, how does a gas station benefit from having someone loiter for 30+ minutes? Many of the corner gas stations just won't benefit from adding chargers, unless the chargers themselves are profitable.

I just watched a TV show on Dunkin Donuts and how it became very profitable by redesigning all of its locations to churn people out with to go orders. Having 12 guys sitting around drinking coffee all day was making the company lose money, when they originally catered to a longer in-store crowd. McDonalds is doing the same thing removing their play places, they just don't want people sitting there all day, the insurance cost is more than the sales benefit. The cost of adding a charger to the corner gas station and store goes up considerably, if they need to change the whole store to accommodate customers with longer stays. I don't see these locations becoming the charging spots of the future.

But without chargers I’m not stopping at all. What happens when 10% of cars are EVs? Can Wawa, Sheetz, Circle K, and the others survive a 10% cut in the number of customers?

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[Zap]

This! Tesla long ago (in EV time) set the standard for a charging experience…plug in and you’re done. This is almost as good, one simple extra step of tapping your phone or watch with Apple Pay on a screen. No app, no screen menu, no NFC card, no resetting the screen, no doing things in the right order, etc etc. Way better than so many stories of people fighting current charging networks. Kudos to Circle K.

 

[viennaxmas]

They are not the only ones... 7eleven is the next: https://corp.7-eleven.com/corp-pres...new-electric-vehicle-charging-network-7charge

 

[mr.Magoo]

They are not the only ones... 7eleven is the next

Only that they force you to register to even see their minimal (as of today) network.
If you don't live in Denver, LA, Sacramento, Dallas or Tampa, don't bother.

 

[3rdgenfan]

The key to this is for big oil companies to see themselves as energy companies and for retailers that cater to drivers like 7-Eleven, QuickCheck, Speedway, WaWa, etc. to start adding chargers.

With 7Eleven owning Speedway and the Sunoco Retail operations, I'm certain we'll start seeing them install those on the PA/OH Turnpike corridor and hopefully Sunoco would be wise enough to do it on their NJTP stores, but considering I think those are the only remaining corporate owned locations, they may just be waiting for the contract to run out with the TP Admin before 7Eleven can take over.

 

[RickLightning]

The issue with gas stations as currently designed is most want you in there for 5 minutes. Assuming there's no major change in charging technology, how does a gas station benefit from having someone loiter for 30+ minutes? Many of the corner gas stations just won't benefit from adding chargers, unless the chargers themselves are profitable.

I just watched a TV show on Dunkin Donuts and how it became very profitable by redesigning all of its locations to churn people out with to go orders. Having 12 guys sitting around drinking coffee all day was making the company lose money, when they originally catered to a longer in-store crowd. McDonalds is doing the same thing removing their play places, they just don't want people sitting there all day, the insurance cost is more than the sales benefit. The cost of adding a charger to the corner gas station and store goes up considerably, if they need to change the whole store to accommodate customers with longer stays. I don't see these locations becoming the charging spots of the future.

Yet many of these chains are installing fast chargers. Why? Because they attract people who wouldn't stop there otherwise. And, because they know you can sit in your vehicle and eat your donut and drink your coffee. And, they know that even a 15 minute charge might be enough.

A simple Google search will show you a significant list of fast food chains, and gas chains, adding fast chargers. I think the problem you're having is the term "corner gas stations". Many gas stations are part of a large chain, and many are located in great locations for fast charging along major routes.

I recently drove across Florida on 60, and was shocked to find two brand new chain gas stations with no charging in the middle of the state where it would be used.

 

[IdeaOfTheDayCom]

With 7Eleven owning Speedway and the Sunoco Retail operations, I'm certain we'll start seeing them install those on the PA/OH Turnpike corridor and hopefully Sunoco would be wise enough to do it on their NJTP stores, but considering I think those are the only remaining corporate owned locations, they may just be waiting for the contract to run out with the TP Admin before 7Eleven can take over.

Some of the major highways are controlled by their respective state transit authorities, so they can mandate the installation of DC Fast Chargers in Rest / Service Areas, so we don't need to wait for Big Oil or the retail outlets to decide to install them.

This has already happened with the NY Thruway (87), Garden State Parkway and the NJ Turnpike. In NJ, they initially started with a goal of 79 Tesla chargers along the NJ Turnpike, but the contract required Tesla to provide infrastructure to non-Tesla charging companies so they can just tap in.

I've seen quite a few on the NJ Turnpike, and a few along the Garden State Parkway rest areas, but they're not reliable right now.

Here's the official announcement from the NJ Turnpike Authority from 2020. https://www.njta.com/newsroom/tesla-agreement#:~:text=The New Jersey Turnpike Authority Commissioners today approved,chargers on the Turnpike from 20 to 76.

I should mention that although it mentions its only at 8 service areas... that's the lion's share. There are only 11.


1. OCEAN VIEW SERVICE AREA (BOTH DIRECTIONS)
2. FRANK SINATRA SERVICE AREA (BOTH DIRECTIONS)
3. CELIA CRUZ SERVICE AREA (BOTH DIRECTIONS)
4. JUDY BLUME SERVICE AREA (BOTH DIRECTIONS)
5. BON JOVI SERVICE AREA (BOTH DIRECTIONS)
6. COLONIA NORTH SERVICE AREA (NORTHBOUND)
7. COLONIA SOUTH SERVICE AREA (SOUTHBOUND)
8. VAUXHALL SERVICE AREA (NORTHBOUND)
9. LARRY DOBY SERVICE AREA (NORTHBOUND)
10. BROOKDALE SOUTH SERVICE AREA (SOUTHBOUND)
11. JAMES GANDOLFINI SERVICE AREA (BOTH DIRECTIONS)

 

[FordLightningMan]

A lot of the larger corporations, especially those which are public, have pledges to reduce their carbon footprint. These companies may have non-financial incentives to install these chargers, which absolutely is a good thing. Many (most?) of the gas stations / corner stores near me aren't part of large chains. The truth is, many of these that aren't in walkable locations will likely be out of business in the next 5-10 years. EV spread is much more beneficial to the financially liquid chains who can afford the installations, there will be a huge shift to the fueling/charging landscape.

What I still can't reconcile is for inner city locations near the local non-franchise gas stations, where are the chargers going? These are areas with mostly on street parking as well. EV ownership in my suburban area which is full of room is rapidly increasing, when I go into the city I just don't see EVs. Maybe some corporation will step up and for a PR move put chargers in these areas? More likely, these areas will need to be publicly funded or highly incentivized to make sense.

 

[IdeaOfTheDayCom]

A lot of the larger corporations, especially those which are public, have pledges to reduce their carbon footprint. These companies may have non-financial incentives to install these chargers, which absolutely is a good thing. Many (most?) of the gas stations / corner stores near me aren't part of large chains. The truth is, many of these that aren't in walkable locations will likely be out of business in the next 5-10 years. EV spread is much more beneficial to the financially liquid chains who can afford the installations, there will be a huge shift to the fueling/charging landscape.

What I still can't reconcile is for inner city locations near the local non-franchise gas stations, where are the chargers going? These are areas with mostly on street parking as well. EV ownership in my suburban area which is full of room is rapidly increasing, when I go into the city I just don't see EVs. Maybe some corporation will step up and for a PR move put chargers in these areas? More likely, these areas will need to be publicly funded or highly incentivized to make sense.

The inner city's charging needs are quite different from rural areas mainly because people living there rely on it as their primary way to charge, but rural owners charge at home and only need chargers along highways for when they take long trips.

When I open an EV Charging App like PlugShare in the NYC area, I see a massive sea of chargers in the inner city. Most of those locations are parking garages, but they're planning on putting a bunch of them curbside at some point as combination parking meter / charging station.

As you can see, virtually all of the NYC chargers are parking lots like this:

 

[FordLightningMan]

NYC is one of the wealthiest places on the planet, and anyone who is driving/parking in the city has even more wealth than the average resident. Due to this, there's a financial incentive to add charging, as you're appealing to a customer base with cash who's willing to pay.

What about poorer cities? Rust belt cities don't have anywhere near the same charging infrastructure, it's really a challenge that won't be easy to solve. I'd estimate that around 100k people are parking on streets in my city, and half of these people are lower income.

I know this is a thread derail, but rather than get excited about this charging, it just made me think about how lacking we are in other charging areas. For suburbanites and wealthier people, the EV revolution is well underway. For at least a quarter of American drivers, we're likely a decade away from infrastructure that even considers them.

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