Read before you order! Expect 50% range loss in winter in Northern states.

[vandy1981]

Driving faster in a bigger/heavier car will cause greater energy looses compared to a smaller car.

If Ford's strategy was to deliver promised EPA range with the Mach E, why do you think they won't massage the variables to do the same with the F150L? I'm sure the very smart engineers that worked on this truck are aware that road load is non-linear as speed increases.

I'm not sure why you're assuming the worst rather than basing predictions on Ford's (albeit limited) track record with the Mach E. Anyway, we will have real-world data in less than a month which will be much more believable than two randos arguing on the internet.....

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[dirtdiver]

Just like all EV's there will be some things we like and things that are a pain. I bet the vast majority of Lightening owners can live with shorter range for some months of the year. For the ~10% that this is an issue they cant live with- this is a good heads up.

 

[vandy1981]

That’s why I will never own a battery powered pos vehicle. No thanks!

I drove past this burning F150 last July. I alerted the national media but no one seemed to care. I guarantee it would have been on the front page of every car blog if it had been a Lightning....

 

[VTbuckeye]

Charging the battery adds heat. Ending your charging immediately prior to departure in cold weather will initially help with efficiency/range. In the cold I sometimes bump the target charge level one half to one hour prior to departure in one of our cars. I anticipate that it would work the same with the lightning, though it may take longer due to the increased battery size/weight. We will all, individually and collectively on these forums, figure out strategies to maximize range/efficiency, but we will need the vehicles in our possession and weather to establish baseline range/efficiency in different conditions and then devise mitigation methods to deal with these conditions. It's kinda fun (though my wife would disagree).

 

[sotek2345]

Charging the battery adds heat. Ending your charging immediately prior to departure in cold weather will initially help with efficiency/range. In the cold I sometimes bump the target charge level one half to one hour prior to departure in one of our cars. I anticipate that it would work the same with the lightning, though it may take longer due to the increased battery size/weight. We will all, individually and collectively on these forums, figure out strategies to maximize range/efficiency, but we will need the vehicles in our possession and weather to establish baseline range/efficiency in different conditions and then devise mitigation methods to deal with these conditions. It's kinda fun (though my wife would disagree).

Ford has a system in place to let you set departure times in Fordpass. Setting this time (it is a schedule - great for leaving for work each day at the same time), has the vehicle precondition both the cabin and battery (heating or cooling as needed) and make sure you are at your target charge level right when you leave.

Great system for routine use, but a bit of a pain to set up for 1 time use (you have to set the schedule and then delete it when one), but much easier than trying to manually do it buy guessing at extra charging times.

 

[VTbuckeye]

Ford has a system in place to let you set departure times in Fordpass. Setting this time (it is a schedule - great for leaving for work each day at the same time), has the vehicle precondition both the cabin and battery (heating or cooling as needed) and make sure you are at your target charge level right when you leave.

Great system for routine use, but a bit of a pain to set up for 1 time use (you have to set the schedule and then delete it when one), but much easier than trying to manually do it buy guessing at extra charging times.

Our target charge level on the Volvo is 80 percent. When I go out for my morning run with the dog I will up it to 90 percent. The car will spend the next 15 to 30 minutes warming the battery (depending on the temperature) and then the state of charge starts increasing. If I could simply change the target charge level from inside the house, versus going into the cold garage would be great. Hopefully Ford pass will allow target soc changes remotely. I could schedule the Volvo, but I don't always know who if I will take the car or if my wife will get it for the day.

 

[sotek2345]

Our target charge level on the Volvo is 80 percent. When I go out for my morning run with the dog I will up it to 90 percent. The car will spend the next 15 to 30 minutes warming the battery (depending on the temperature) and then the state of charge starts increasing. If I could simply change the target charge level from inside the house, versus going into the cold garage would be great. Hopefully Ford pass will allow target soc changes remotely. I could schedule the Volvo, but I don't always know who if I will take the car or if my wife will get it for the day.

I know you can push it too 100% remotely, but I am not sure about values other than that. You can also set a "schedule" for ~30 minutes (or whatever) in the future remotely and it will start prepping for you.

 

[p52Ranch]

Every ICE vehicle gets lower mpg during winter, due to winter gas, cold temperatures, and engine warmup. Many lose 20% or more. Many consumers aren't aware of that either, or even know that winter gas exists.

20% loss for gasoline ICE winter driving would be a bit of a stretch unless drivers are letting their cars idle for an excessive period.

The winter gasoline contains lighter compounds and therefore is less dense in the winter than summer gasoline but it only accounts for maybe a 2% drop in fuel economy.

Those of us in rural areas in the southern half of the country see almost a negligible winter impact. (probably less than 0.75%) summer to winter. Someone in Chicago, Minneapolis, New York or other Northern EPA non-attainment zone get a double whammy of burning RFG gasoline (even lower summer RVP) and being in a northern climate where higher RVP gasoline is needed for winter fuel so your car will start.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a...ces, summer,economy outside the summer months.

 

[RickLightning]

20% loss for gasoline ICE winter driving would be a bit of a stretch unless drivers are letting their cars idle for an excessive period.

The winter gasoline contains lighter compounds and therefore is less dense in the winter than summer gasoline but it only accounts for maybe a 2% drop in fuel economy.

Those of us in rural areas in the southern half of the country see almost a negligible winter impact. (probably less than 0.75%) summer to winter. Someone in Chicago, Minneapolis, New York or other Northern EPA non-attainment zone get a double whammy of burning RFG gasoline (even lower summer RVP) and being in a northern climate where higher RVP gasoline is needed for winter fuel so your car will start.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a15339380/the-vapor-rub-summer-versus-winter-gasoline-explained/#:~:text=Despite those higher prices, summer,economy outside the summer months.

Nope.

"... 15% lower at 20 degrees than at 77 degrees"
"... drop as much as 24% for short (3 to 4 mile) trips"
"...hybrids... 30% to 34%"
"...electric vehicles... 39% in mixed city and highway driving, and range can drop by 41%"

https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/coldweather.shtml

 

[Roy2001]

That's why I will only expect 120 miles range during winter and 150 miles during summer.

Winter + heater + freeway > 75mph = range killer, consider 90-95% charging, and you cannot drain to 0 miles, plus battery degradation, expect 100-150 miles usable range for SR, and 150-200 for ER.

 

[p52Ranch]

Nope.

"... 15% lower at 20 degrees than at 77 degrees"
"... drop as much as 24% for short (3 to 4 mile) trips"
"...hybrids... 30% to 34%"
"...electric vehicles... 39% in mixed city and highway driving, and range can drop by 41%"

https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/coldweather.shtml

My point was that the use of winter gasoline only contributes a small percentage of the overall ICE winter fuel economy degradation.

I agree that many of the same winter environmental factors that impact EV range in the winter also impact ICE range.
- Short trips
- Lower tire pressure
- Cold soak (doesn't matter if it is cold soak of the battery or of an ICE vehicle drivetrain)
- Increased time warming up a vehicle before driving.
- Increased friction losses
- Increased aerodynamic drag in denser colder air.

 

[RickLightning]

My point was that the use of winter gasoline only contributes a small percentage of the overall ICE winter fuel economy degradation.

I agree that many of the same winter environmental factors that impact EV range in the winter also impact ICE range.
- Short trips
- Lower tire pressure
- Cold soak (doesn't matter if it is cold soak of the battery or of an ICE vehicle drivetrain)
- Increased time warming up a vehicle before driving.
- Increased friction losses
- Increased aerodynamic drag in denser colder air.

Yes, gas is a small part of it, but I noted "due to winter gas, cold temperatures, and engine warmup" in the post you responded to.

 

[MJ Heat]

I get under 500 miles on my 3.5 ecoboost (Raptor / 36 gallon tank). On my 2.7L with a 23 gallon tank, I used to get about 330 miles. This is using premium (91 octane) non-ethanol fuel for both.

Given my commute, I expect the ER lightning to deliver more real world range for daily use than I got in my 2.7. (city and side streets, lots of stop lights, mostly ~35mph with 1 section of 45mph driving).

Crew cab 4 x 4 157”wb with 3.5 ecoboost & 3.31 rear end. I am meticulous about air pressure, tune-ups, air filters, etc. & mostly take longer trips driving like I’m old, because I am. Typically I get actual hand measured 21.5mpg. With a 36 gallon tank I regularly go 700 miles with 87 octane regular unleaded gas between fillups.

 

[sotek2345]

Crew cab 4 x 4 157”wb with 3.5 ecoboost & 3.31 rear end. I am meticulous about air pressure, tune-ups, air filters, etc. & mostly take longer trips driving like I’m old, because I am. Typically I get actual hand measured 21.5mpg. With a 36 gallon tank I regularly go 700 miles with 87 octane regular unleaded gas between fillups.

Yeah - I am getting an average of 13.7 mpg in my Raptor (3.5 ecoboost) and got 14.7 mpg in my previous 2.7 ecoboost. Short drives kill mpg.

 

[LightningShow]

Well, on a more positive note, i don’t get anything like 50% range loss in my Bolt in New England winters. Most of my driving is in MA/NH. EPA combined range is 3.9mi/kWh, i’ve never seen below 3 mi/kwh as long as i plan ahead a little. Pre-conditioning and using conservative HVAC settings keeps the range up fairly well. My GF gets range around 2 mi/kwh but she has a short commute and jacks the HVAC as high as possible, she also lets it warm up while it’s unplugged pretty regularly. It spends more time warming up than driving when she’s taking it. It just takes a little forethought if you’re planning on driving a longer distance in the winter.

I’m not worried about the winter range in my Lariat ER at all, i’m sure 200+ miles will be no problem for a roadtrip.

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