6,842 Lightnings sold so far, 2,373 in July 2022 📊

[BennyTheBeaver]

The Rivian is really the Truck Model 3 owners should be looking at and it’s the Truck Tesla should have put out.

The Rivian is really the Truck Model S owners should be looking at, the Lightning Pro is the model Model 3 owners should be looking at.

Just from a $$$ and value standpoint...

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[Yellow Buddy]

All that and some have never owned a Truck but expect it to perform like a small compact Sedan along with luxury items.

Once the CT is released (2030) there will be a mass exodus. I will then pick up a Pro as a 2nd Lightning.

Um...isn't the CT larger than the F-150? I don't see how that would make that line of thinking any better..

 

[F150ROD]

Um...isn't the CT larger than the F-150? I don't see how that would make that line of thinking any better..

Their line of thinking is that it’s a Tesla so it’s automatically better

 

[Yellow Buddy]

The Rivian is really the Truck Model S owners should be looking at, the Lightning Pro is the model Model 3 owners should be looking at.

Just from a $$$ and value standpoint...

As an owner of a Model S and a Model X, but not a Model 3, my 2c.

The F-150L Pro is the value play here. I've picked up mine and I have zero plans of abandoning it even when the CT comes out.

If I do move on from the F-150L Pro, it'll be because I didn't order the Tow Tech Package (my fault) and because it doesn't have CoPilot 2.0 Assist, which can be solved by stepping up.

However if I do step up, I would probably at this point step to the Rivian R1T as this is my first full sized truck and it is a bit on the large side for me. As a existing reservation holder my R1T will also be $20k cheaper than stepping up to say a Lariat ER.

If I go to the Rivian R1T, I will miss the massive amounts of storage available to me. The availability of aftermarket support. The ability to call my local dealer to schedule a service appointment. The ability to do mods to my truck. That's not even factoring in the usability of V2H and V2V.

The solution? Waiting for a Ford Ranger EV and checking Forscan to see what my limitations are..

 

[Yellow Buddy]

Their line of thinking is that it’s a Tesla so it’s automatically better

Give it time...there have been plenty of folks who have soured on Tesla thanks to their horrendous service, blocking right to repair, etc. I'm one of those. We've just been stuck because there hasn't been many options. When options do pick up, the charging network is still far superior.

What we need is more reliable competition on EV supply and EV support. Once that happens, Tesla's quality issues and poor service will be harder to ignore.

 

[BennyTheBeaver]

The solution? Waiting for a Ford Ranger EV and checking Forscan to see what my limitations are..

The Ford Ranger EV will be the best selling EV truck by 2028, in my opinion.

 

[Blainestang]

Their line of thinking is that it’s a Tesla so it’s automatically better

Then why did they trade their Tesla for a Lightning in the first place, which is the premise of this discussion?

There are a some people who think Tesla can do no wrong and that they're "automatically better", but those people probably aren't selling their Teslas to buy Fords in the first place.

 

[F150ROD]

Then why did they trade their Tesla for a Lightning in the first place, which is the premise of this discussion?

There are a some people who think Tesla can do no wrong and that they're "automatically better", but those people probably aren't selling their Teslas to buy Fords in the first place.

I know of 3 acquaintance's that have that thought process, bought other EV’s(Taycan, Polestar, ID3) just to “prove” they were right….. I know, there’s crazy people out there. I’m there are a handful who will buy the Lightning just to “try it out” flip it and then get back into a Tesla.

 

[Blainestang]

What we need is more reliable competition on EV supply and EV support. Once that happens, Tesla's quality issues and poor service will be harder to ignore.

Quality is apparently much better from Shanghai, so it's reasonable to think the biggest problem is the Fremont factory that is relatively cobbled together and rarely gets a break to update/upgrade. It seems likely that by the time Ford and VW and others are really cranking out EVs that Tesla's initial quality and QC will be improved.

Also, like you said, they haven't had much reason to reduce production to improve quality since they've had little competition and more demand than supply regardless.

I do think they'll have to address it more at some point, but I think it's going to be a solvable problem. Now, will the reputation of bad quality follow them for a while even if they fix it? Yeah.

 

[Blainestang]

I know of 3 acquaintance's that have that thought process, bought other EV’s(Taycan, Polestar, ID3) just to “prove” they were right….. I know, there’s crazy people out there. I’m there are a handful who will buy the Lightning just to “try it out” flip it and then get back into a Tesla.

Most people won't or can't afford to buy a new $35k - $80k+++ car just to prove a point, though, so I think those will be relatively limited.

 

[FordLightningMan]

I'm perfectly content with a Lightning and a Model 3 in my garage. They are the perfect yin and yang. Rather than fighting over which is better, why not embrace that both have their excellent (and not so great) qualities? Variety is the spice of life afterall!

 

[shutterbug]

This answers a question I had in another thread, how many MY22 will be sold? If sale means by dealer to customer and 10/10 is the last MY22 production date, presumably this means sales of MY22 occur hrough November. With one month being half sales, there should be about 6,000 of additional sales in MY22 at the current run rate. 13k Lightnings for MY22 estimated, this lines up pretty well with the percentage of people who got pushed to MY23 and the original MY22 15,000 estimate.

So when Ford's poobahs were denying 15,000 estimate, they were really saying that there was no way for them to reach it.

 

[Yellow Buddy]

Quality is apparently much better from Shanghai, so it's reasonable to think the biggest problem is the Fremont factory that is relatively cobbled together and rarely gets a break to update/upgrade. It seems likely that by the time Ford and VW and others are really cranking out EVs that Tesla's initial quality and QC will be improved.

Also, like you said, they haven't had much reason to reduce production to improve quality since they've had little competition and more demand than supply regardless.

I do think they'll have to address it more at some point, but I think it's going to be a solvable problem. Now, will the reputation of bad quality follow them for a while even if they fix it? Yeah.

That last part is key, how long does someone hold on for? I adopted early and knew what I was in for, they used to be phenomenal at service. But 2018-2019 all that turned when they scaled up. I held on for a little bit more but if I have to keep holding out and roll the dice, why not roll it with someone else?

It might have the same quality issues but if they're early in the curve, they may be more flexible and focused on service. That would service me while Tesla gets their act together. If they do, I wouldn't hesitate to go back, but I wouldn't go back with the way they are today unless I had no other options.

I say this as I still have a Model S in which I'm fighting them to replace my front control arm bushings, not the entire arm which costs significantly more just the bushings. They can't do that, have to replace the arm. Maybe they don't have a press, maybe they don't have bushings..whatever. Fine, replace the entire arms and bushings and align the thing.

But, my local service center only replaces front and rear suspension components together. A paid inspection revealed nothing wrong with the rear control arms nor their bushings, but they won't replace the front w/o also doing the rears because "they commonly fail at the same time" Right...but my control arms didn't fail, my bushings are worn. Nope. Either no work or $4,000 to replace everything.

The dealer may rip me off, but if I don't like them I can source OEM or non-OEM parts and go DIY or independent. In this situation I'm stuck regardless of which Tesla SC I go to. I'm off on a rant now..

 

[Mr. Flibble]

This is underwhelming. F stock sliding from $25 to $11 from initial hype about Lightning to production numbers in July tells quite a story despite promises of producing 80k in 2023 and 160k in 2024. Reality check doesn’t add up.

Not a surprise really, Ford's stock is trading at a reasonable value, as opposed to say, Tesla, which is grossly over valued based on speculation and anticipation of future profits.

Markets are a voting machine, investing is a weighing machine.-- Benjamin Graham.

 

[Blainestang]

That last part is key, how long does someone hold on for? I adopted early and knew what I was in for, they used to be phenomenal at service. But 2018-2019 all that turned when they scaled up. I held on for a little bit more but if I have to keep holding out and roll the dice, why not roll it with someone else?

If all else was equal, I agree, but Tesla has some notable advantages (and disadvantages) that may outweigh the risk of poor service. Lots of personal preference in the weighting of those pros/cons, of course.

Service experience for my recent BMWs has been bad, too. My best service has been from MINI compared to BMW/Tesla, surprisingly.

It might have the same quality issues but if they're early in the curve, they may be more flexible and focused on service. That would service me while Tesla gets their act together. If they do, I wouldn't hesitate to go back, but I wouldn't go back with the way they are today unless I had no other options.

I say this as I still have a Model S in which I'm fighting them to replace my front control arm bushings, not the entire arm which costs significantly more just the bushings. They can't do that, have to replace the arm. Maybe they don't have a press, maybe they don't have bushings..whatever. Fine, replace the entire arms and bushings and align the thing.

But, my local service center only replaces front and rear suspension components together. A paid inspection revealed nothing wrong with the rear control arms nor their bushings, but they won't replace the front w/o also doing the rears because "they commonly fail at the same time" Right...but my control arms didn't fail, my bushings are worn. Nope. Either no work or $4,000 to replace everything.

The dealer may rip me off, but if I don't like them I can source OEM or non-OEM parts and go DIY or independent. In this situation I'm stuck regardless of which Tesla SC I go to. I'm off on a rant now..

You can't just get the parts and have someone else do it that doesn't have the front/rear requirement. I never had to buy parts for mine, but it seems that, in theory, you can buy parts for them, based on recent forum posts. They go to the Tesla parts catalog and call or use the app to order, apparently. It's a bit hit or miss depending on who you get ahold of, etc., as it is with other things, but seems technically feasible.

I went to the parts catalog for Model S (Apr 16 - Jan 21) and it gave the following:

1	FR UPR CTRL ARM, LEFT HAND, DUAL MOTOR	1043965-00-B	Over-the-Counter(No VIN)	1	1
1	FR UPR CTRL ARM, RH, DUAL MOTOR	1043966-00-B	Over-the-Counter(No VIN)	1	1

The over-the-counter indicates you should be able to buy the parts OTC. Also, it does look like there's no part number for the bushings alone. Does someone like Unplugged Performance offer aftermarket bushings or arms? Looks like they do for the Feb '21+ Model S, but not the 16-21 models, unfortunately.

It's definitely not the best situation, no doubt. Good luck!

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