Tripping Pro Power breaker with 120v welder

[MaintGrl]

ALEXOSE, you don't mention whether you have the optional 9.6kw ProPower...

A) if you DON'T, the bed outlet is shared by the Cab and Frunk outlets, on a 2.4kw inverter, which is a Maximum amperage of 20 amps, shared by all of those outlets. Were you using any other outlets at the same time?

B) if you DO, the bed outlet circuits (A) and (B) originate from the REAR 7.2kw 240v inverter, which is a Maximum amperage of 30amps for the 240v twist-lock outlet, and 60 amps of 120v shared between the two 120v outlets(30 amps each)... yes, that's 30amp from each 120v OUTLET... I've tested this and pulled 30amps with several heaters and a toaster before the circuit tripped.
These outlets are shared from the 240v inverter, so while the outlets 'look' like typical household outlets, they are actually engineered to handle the load. Nothing in Ford's documents shows these as 'only' 20 amps of power, although many conversations and terms seem to label them that way.

I would suggest that it's not just the truck, or the truck's power, or even your 120v welding device, it's just the combination of the sensitivity of the truck's power monitoring while the device is in use.

Your home's breaker, wiring, and main panel are not nearly as 'sensitive' to this up and down of amperage while the welder is in operation - as most home breakers can handle a lot more moments of being 'close to' or even 'over' the actual breaker's limits before actually tripping. A breaker is not typically designed to 'immediately' trip just because a short time of amperage might otherwise take it too far, but it's more about the 'constant' power, or HEAT, that causes the tripping.

William, Well Said, Many good points!
HF Welders are "Dirty" the vehicles onboard circuitry is a lot more sensitive to feedback than ANY home wiring would be...

Sponsored

 

[hturnerfamily]

Wow that is great information. Strange of them to do that 30 amp thing on what anyone else would assume to be a 20 amp circuit. Guessing this is a combination of cost savings to not have additional 20 amp circuit protection. And also ends up being good for the user with less complaints and less nuisance tripping. Users tend to push it and overload things, and like you said it is more sensitive than a home breaker. Much less likely to nuisance trip if the users think it is 20 amps but it's really 30.

if you think about it though, it's VERY uncommon, and maybe even impractical that ANY device, appliance, or item plugged into any of the 'regular' outlets would ever ask for more than 15-18 amps, at MAX, regardless... can't think of one.
So, the reality is that while they 'can' give up to 30amps, it's highly likely they will never be asked to.

You might suggest that "yeah, but if someone uses a extension strip, power strip, or adapter, they might have several things powered by the outlet, all at the same time...", which, on the surface is true, as that is what I had to do to even 'test' the amperage of the outlet, but the weak leak would then be the strip, extension cord, adapter, etc., and NOT the outlet itself...

 

[Runaway Tractor]

Never underestimate the creativity of stupid people and electricity! But to that point, the unlikely nature of it happening does lead to basically Ford being too cheap to put in separate 20 amp breakers....

 

[alexose]

ALEXOSE, you don't mention whether you have the optional 9.6kw ProPower...

...

Your home's breaker, wiring, and main panel are not nearly as 'sensitive' to this up and down of amperage while the welder is in operation - as most home breakers can handle a lot more moments of being 'close to' or even 'over' the actual breaker's limits before actually tripping. A breaker is not typically designed to 'immediately' trip just because a short time of amperage might otherwise take it too far, but it's more about the 'constant' power, or HEAT, that causes the tripping.

Thanks for the awesome reply, hturnerfamily. I do have the 9.6kw ProPower, and of the four 20A outlets in the bed, I was plugged into the upper-left one.

I think you're absolutely right-- Breakers designed for home use are much more tolerant of sudden peaks, like the kind my cheapo welder must be drawing. Whereas these inverter-powered plugs have a more strict cutoff.

It looks like my best course of action is to get an adapter so I can draw from the 240v 30A plug instead. Although, given what you said earlier, I wonder if I'll trip that one as well?

 

[v2h8484]

That welder is inverter based. GFCI nuisance trip is likely the culprit even if you don't get an alert stating so.

 

[alexose]

That welder is inverter based. GFCI nuisance trip is likely the culprit even if you don't get an alert stating so.

I'd believe that, too, even though the error I got was the "Item(s) plugged in exceeded the system's maximum capacity" one. Unfortunately I don't have a transformer based model to compare it with...

 

[Whammy Bar]

My Lincoln Weldpak runs off ProPower w/out issue. And an angle grinder. And my compressor. And my battery chargers.

 

[ctuan13]

if you think about it though, it's VERY uncommon, and maybe even impractical that ANY device, appliance, or item plugged into any of the 'regular' outlets would ever ask for more than 15-18 amps, at MAX, regardless... can't think of one.
So, the reality is that while they 'can' give up to 30amps, it's highly likely they will never be asked to.

You might suggest that "yeah, but if someone uses a extension strip, power strip, or adapter, they might have several things powered by the outlet, all at the same time...", which, on the surface is true, as that is what I had to do to even 'test' the amperage of the outlet, but the weak leak would then be the strip, extension cord, adapter, etc., and NOT the outlet itself...

Actually, for me this is a great discovery. I plan to use my truck to supply power to my teardrop camper when boondocking. My tiny camper has a 30A 120V input. I had been lamenting the fact that while the truck had a 30A circuit, it was a 240V circuit and the camper can only handle 120V. But now armed with this knowledge, I'll have to do more testing, because this is very good news for me.

I'm sure there are others with campers who will be pleasantly surprised to discover this as well.

 

[Runaway Tractor]

My tiny camera has a 30A 120V input. I had been lamenting the fact that while the truck had a 30A circuit, it was a 240V circuit and the camper can only handle 120V. But now armed with this knowledge, I'll have to do more testing, because this is very good news for me.

You can get an adapter that will split the 30amp 240v twist lock out to two 30 amp 120v twist locks.

 

[ctuan13]

You can get an adapter that will split the 30amp 240v twist lock out to two 30 amp 120v twist locks.

Really? Do you have a link? It actually steps down the voltage? Because it's not just a matter of receptacle, I need 120V not 240.

 

[Runaway Tractor]

Really? Do you have a link? It actually steps down the voltage? Because it's not just a matter of receptacle, I need 120V not 240.

Nope it doesn't have have to step anything down. That 30 amp 240v outlet consists two split-phase 120v circuits. Hot to hot is 240v. Each of the two hots to neutral is 120v each. Something like this would do it. https://a.co/d/dEWC1Nf

This is how any 240v outlet with a neutral works. You can't do it if there isn't no neutral, like some appliance outlets.

 

[hturnerfamily]

he's right... there are PLENTY of adapters for ALL SORTS of situations, like yours...

but, honestly, your camper doesn't 'need' 30 amps of power, even though it has a '30 amp cord', it simply needs enough to power your needs, which can also be accomplished by the very 120v 'household' outlets, even if they were 'only' 20amps : )

I realize that if you have the roof air conditioner, you might think you'd 'have' to have 30amp power, but, that too, is not required to operate it... although, while it's running, you will certainly have 'less' power for other things, although the only other 'draw' might be the MICROWAVE, which is only ever used sparingly, and for not very long, even then.

Most every camper on this planet can easily deal with simple 20amp 120v power... although the common 'typical' manufacturer's wiring is the RVing 30amp cord.

Walmart has adapters for these very situations. I'll admit, though, the 30amp 240v 'twist lock' is not something they would carry - but Lowes or HD probably easily does. Online sources are very easy to find these, as well.

 

[ctuan13]

Nope it doesn't have have to step anything down. That 30 amp 240v outlet consists two split-phase 120v circuits. Hot to hot is 240v. Each of the two hots to neutral is 120v each. Something like this would do it. https://a.co/d/dEWC1Nf

This is how any 240v outlet with a neutral works. You can't do it if there isn't no neutral, like some appliance outlets.

Ahh right, I gotcha. I figured it might be something like that, but obviously I'm not an expert on electrical wiring lol

Good to know!

 

[GrokTime]

Nope it doesn't have have to step anything down. That 30 amp 240v outlet consists two split-phase 120v circuits. Hot to hot is 240v. Each of the two hots to neutral is 120v each. Something like this would do it. https://a.co/d/dEWC1Nf

This is how any 240v outlet with a neutral works. You can't do it if there isn't no neutral, like some appliance outlets.

I just ran into this same problem and I am hoping someone can help clarify for me what my options are for buying an L14-30P to 6-20R adapter.

I bought a Harbor Freight electric log splitter and it can't be run off the 110 outlets in the back of my lightning because it keeps tripping the circuit. The log splitter says it is 15 AMP so I figured the 20 amp outlets would be fine.

I don't understand the above advice for using the 30 amp outlet with an adapter that does not step the voltage down. Can someone explain it to me? I am don't really understand. Thanks.

 

[Maquis]

I just ran into this same problem and I am hoping someone can help clarify for me what my options are for buying an L14-30P to 6-20R adapter.

I bought a Harbor Freight electric log splitter and it can't be run off the 110 outlets in the back of my lightning because it keeps tripping the circuit. The log splitter says it is 15 AMP so I figured the 20 amp outlets would be fine.

I don't understand the above advice for using the 30 amp outlet with an adapter that does not step the voltage down. Can someone explain it to me? I am don't really understand. Thanks.

Is it tripping due to overload or due to ground fault?

Sponsored