Backup Power

[sealingandbolting]

Neither Ford or SunRun (after 8 calls) can answer the technical questions about how the Lighting can actually be used to power the house, questions like does it have a transfer switch (needed to isolate the backup power from the power company) (yes), does it generate a sine ware and can it be used with an existing PV system (both answers are not clear). Here is what I have found. Per the Ford spec sheet the Home Integration System they are advertising is actually made by Delta Electronics, Freemont CA, 877-440-5851, https://www.delta-americas.com/en-US/index. The truck is limited to supplying about 80 amps, or 9.6 KWH, assuming the E10_BDI is used. Ford's marketing information is based on using 30 KWH per day. The average home without air-conditioning, swimming pools or other major electrical appliances uses 15 to 25 KWH per day. If you have a 200 map main panel, legally the electrical codes will likely require that a sub panel be installed with just the lights and plugs that will match the inverter output capacity. You can't use an 80 amp power source to power a 200 amp rated panel. Given the cost involved of the inverter and installation (starting around $9,600), you might be better off getting a whole house generator that runs on natural gas (around $10,000 to $20,000 installed), then you can power your entire house and charge your truck regardless of weather conditions or the length of time the utility power is out.

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[hturnerfamily]

when you look at the real need for any 'whole house' power, which is for SPECIFIC catastrophic or power outage situations, no, you won't need anything NEAR the 'full' 200amp power that your panel box is rated for. NOBODY DOES, EVER, even on a regular basis.
40amp at 240v is a LOT of power for most ANY home - we're not talking about doing EVERYTHING at once, since you don't even do that on a daily basis, but having the BASICS when a power outage is going to be a long-term problem.
Air Conditioning is the primary concern, and where most of the power needs come from, as well as REFRIGERATION, although fridges and freezers take a LOT LESS power, and don't even run 24/7. The other everyday outlets in your home can easily be handled with the Truck's power, along with air conditioning and refrigeration, all at the same time.

Will you be cooking with your 50amp stove during an outage? Probably not. Will you 'have' to have HOT WATER during a power outage? Probably not. See, there are many everyday things you don't 'need' in a catastrophic time.

I will suggest that any home that has access, thru their main panel, of 40amps at 240v power will be JUST FINE. Your panel doesn't operate on 200amps, it is just designed to be able to handle that much. Many hours of the day it's only operating on 30, or even less.

 

[hturnerfamily]

and, no, you don't 'need' a whole-house integrated 'automatic' backup power supply from your truck, but the truck CAN provide you power when you really need it, and that's really the great thing about being able to consider it a GENERATOR, but without NOISE, without FUEL, and with more power than most portable generators can provide.

 

[VTbuckeye]

Our house has natural gas heat and hot water. Overnight we usually use between 200 and 300 watts each hour. If our window AC unit is on and ceiling fans are on we are up to 1.2kw. In the summer we would want AC/fans and to keep the fridge working. In the winter we want the fridge and power for the boiler, circulation pumps and the little bit of power for the hot water heater. 240V x 30 amps (pro power) would give us plenty of power. Our biggest single electric usage is for our vehicles. Almost 50 percent of our power usage is between 8pm and midnight and in a power out situation we would simply not charge the cars. Many houses have 200amp service, but rarely use more than 30 or 40 over the course of an hour. For us to use more than 30amp we would need to run the AC, dishwasher, clothes dryer, bake something in the oven and cook something on the stove (or plug in a car).

 

[merek]

You can power panels with less power than they are capable of. Whole home generators typiclaly have 200A transfer switches for panels only capable of delivering typically 15-20kw of power. I have one. p.s. charging your truck on a generator is going to be tough, unless you severely derate it.

Don't forget that there's separate NEC rules for backup power systems.

 

[FlasherZ]

Huh?

Unless you have less than a 200A panel, it's not going to be an issue.

The default home integration system is only capable of 4 kW feed-in with grid active, 10 kW output without (but that'll never reach your grid panel). Up to 120% panel rating is permitted for backfeeding.

 

[Maquis]

Neither Ford or SunRun (after 8 calls) can answer the technical questions about how the Lighting can actually be used to power the house, questions like does it have a transfer switch (needed to isolate the backup power from the power company) (yes), does it generate a sine ware and can it be used with an existing PV system (both answers are not clear). Here is what I have found. Per the Ford spec sheet the Home Integration System they are advertising is actually made by Delta Electronics, Freemont CA, 877-440-5851, https://www.delta-americas.com/en-US/index. The truck is limited to supplying about 80 amps, or 9.6 KWH, assuming the E10_BDI is used. Ford's marketing information is based on using 30 KWH per day. The average home without air-conditioning, swimming pools or other major electrical appliances uses 15 to 25 KWH per day. If you have a 200 map main panel, legally the electrical codes will likely require that a sub panel be installed with just the lights and plugs that will match the inverter output capacity. You can't use an 80 amp power source to power a 200 amp rated panel. Given the cost involved of the inverter and installation (starting around $9,600), you might be better off getting a whole house generator that runs on natural gas (around $10,000 to $20,000 installed), then you can power your entire house and charge your truck regardless of weather conditions or the length of time the utility power is out.

Based on these questions and statements, you need to consult an electrician well versed in backup power systems. You’re not going to figure it out here.

 

[FlasherZ]

The BDI replaces the solar inverter if you use string inverters. And if you don't (microinverters) there are other common solutions.

It's really not a big deal.

 

[FlasherZ]

Ok, now you can't be taken seriously. I wish you well.

 

[FlasherZ]

Neither Ford or SunRun (after 8 calls) can answer the technical questions about how the Lighting can actually be used to power the house, questions like does it have a transfer switch (needed to isolate the backup power from the power company) (yes), does it generate a sine ware and can it be used with an existing PV system (both answers are not clear). Here is what I have found. Per the Ford spec sheet the Home Integration System they are advertising is actually made by Delta Electronics, Freemont CA, 877-440-5851, https://www.delta-americas.com/en-US/index. The truck is limited to supplying about 80 amps, or 9.6 KWH, assuming the E10_BDI is used. Ford's marketing information is based on using 30 KWH per day. The average home without air-conditioning, swimming pools or other major electrical appliances uses 15 to 25 KWH per day. If you have a 200 map main panel, legally the electrical codes will likely require that a sub panel be installed with just the lights and plugs that will match the inverter output capacity. You can't use an 80 amp power source to power a 200 amp rated panel. Given the cost involved of the inverter and installation (starting around $9,600), you might be better off getting a whole house generator that runs on natural gas (around $10,000 to $20,000 installed), then you can power your entire house and charge your truck regardless of weather conditions or the length of time the utility power is out.

There is a more detailed integration document available. By default Sunrun is installing the 4kW version of Delta's inverter. Delta's documentation calls for a device called MID which acts as a transfer switch and requires critical loads to be moved to a separate panel. During on-grid operation, it permits solar feed-in using UL 1741 safety mechanisms. With grid interruption, it isolates from grid and runs the critical load panel only.

 

[FlasherZ]

I routinely evaluate systems that get installed here from over 10 installers and 80 percent of them are string inverters. The other 20 percent are due to special circumstances like shading, because a micro-inverter install runs 25 percent higher in cost.

I'm not backing out of anything, you just have zero idea what you're talking about. 95 percent of existing installs are just fine for the integration system and will not need derating.

So - I wish you well.

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