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ADM and no sale clause

Poolman02

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Owners that have taken delivery have any had to sign a no sale agreement? Has the ADM gone away or are dealers still trying to charge this?
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RickLightning

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Many dealers are charging ADM. Go to Cars.com and you can see this.

Rarely do they try the no sale agreement, dealer-specific.
 

rdr854

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Owners that have taken delivery have any had to sign a no sale agreement? Has the ADM gone away or are dealers still trying to charge this?
I had to sign a no resale clause. The contract form that included the clause was dated from the early 2010s. The dealer said that the genesis of this clause was to prevent the resale and export of vehicles since manufacturer dealer agreements prohibit dealers from selling vehicles that they know are going to be exported or immediately resold. This is something I have seen at different dealers and not just the Ford dealer where I bought my Lightning.

Incidentally, no ADM.
 

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I took delivery in late July….the subject of ADM and a no sales agreement never came up……..
 

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Lime Green

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I had to sign a no resale clause. The contract form that included the clause was dated from the early 2010s. The dealer said that the genesis of this clause was to prevent the resale and export of vehicles since manufacturer dealer agreements prohibit dealers from selling vehicles that they know are going to be exported or immediately resold. This is something I have seen at different dealers and not just the Ford dealer where I bought my Lightning.
This is standard language in most auto sales contracts. It's the part where you're certifying that you are not a dealer, exporter or acting as an agent for one. This is not a no-resale clause that says you can't sell your Lightning. Once the vehicle is titled in your name, you can do with it as you please. That is the very purpose of holding title. Being a piece of titled property, which must convey to you (the new owner) free of any and all encumbrances. If they want to dictate how and when you can sell or transfer ownership, then they need to provide a concession and be listed as a registrant party on the title or as a lien holder.
 

RickLightning

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This is standard language in most auto sales contracts. It's the part where you're certifying that you are not a dealer, exporter or acting as an agent for one. This is not a no-resale clause that says you can't sell your Lightning. Once the vehicle is titled in your name, you can do with it as you please. That is the very purpose of holding title. Being a piece of titled property, which must convey to you (the new owner) free of any and all encumbrances. If they want to dictate how and when you can sell or transfer ownership, then they need to provide a concession and be listed as a registrant party on the title or as a lien holder.
Actually, no they don't. Ford sent them sample language, but told them to contact their local legal counsel before drafting something. I've seen maybe 2 posts in months of people having to sign such a thing. Most dealers laughed.
 

Lime Green

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Actually, no they don't. Ford sent them sample language, but told them to contact their local legal counsel before drafting something. I've seen maybe 2 posts in months of people having to sign such a thing. Most dealers laughed.
There was never any sample language from Ford. Only a supposed internal memo that supposedly leaked, saying that Ford would support a no-resale term if a dealership wanted to impose one and if it were legally permissible in their market. I have seen absolutely nothing that ever indicated the memo was genuine or valid in any way. It first appeared from a dubious source that had conjured up other bogus stuff. Jim Farley said he was unaware of such a memo when asked about it.

I have yet to see one credible example where anyone signed such a thing, which would never hold up legally if they did, not to mention would not even be permissible in most any state I'm aware of. Seen a couple reports pop up on Reddit and other media. All have turned out to be complete bullshit.

The point of titled property is the title clearly indicates who owns it and who may have a vested interest in that piece of property. A secondary agreement that does not invoke any lien or interest attached to the title can have no imposed effects over what is done with the property the title represents. When it comes time to sell a vehicle, anyone who is not named as a party of ownership or lien holder on the title can fuck right off -- figuratively, literally and legally. There seem to be a lot of people on the interwebs who keep spreading disinformation surrounding how this works while demonstrating they have no understanding what titled property is or how it works.

About the best any dealership could do here to control this, without holding a lien, would be a right of first refusal to buy the truck back, if their customer (new owner) chooses to sell within a finite timeframe. And such an agreements really need to be concisely detailed, purposed and with strict timeframes or deadlines and/or pricing. Otherwise it's just for show, or should I say a totally unethical and most likely legally questionable scare tactic... If such a thing were in place and someone sold their truck, the best a dealership could do is to sue that person for breach of contract and they would have to be able to account for real world damages the sale caused to them. Not going to happen. They could never reverse a sale of titled property, the scope of their damages don't extend beyond any terms that are defined in that secondary agreement.

The best/only argument any proponents or validators of a no-resale clause can ever come up with is John Cena and his GT500. Which there was no actual clause dictating a no-resale situation there, either. The problem was that he was an active and sponsored brand ambassador for Ford. He had to coordinate any sales or transfers or promotion of Ford product with Ford's sponsorship team, which he thought he did by sending a couple emails. They sued Cena over breach of contract, claiming that his actions were damaging to Ford's brand image. Not that he sold the car, which they have no right to directly control.
 

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There was never any sample language from Ford. Only a supposed internal memo that supposedly leaked, saying that Ford would support a no-resale term if a dealership wanted to impose one and if it were legally permissible in their market. I have seen absolutely nothing that ever indicated the memo was genuine or valid in any way. It first appeared from a dubious source that had conjured up other bogus stuff. Jim Farley said he was unaware of such a memo when asked about it.

I have yet to see one credible example where anyone signed such a thing, which would never hold up legally if they did, not to mention would not even be permissible in most any state I'm aware of. Seen a couple reports pop up on Reddit and other media. All have turned out to be complete bullshit.

The point of titled property is the title clearly indicates who owns it and who may have a vested interest in that piece of property. A secondary agreement that does not invoke any lien or interest attached to the title can have no imposed effects over what is done with the property the title represents. When it comes time to sell a vehicle, anyone who is not named as a party of ownership or lien holder on the title can fuck right off -- figuratively, literally and legally. There seem to be a lot of people on the interwebs who keep spreading disinformation surrounding how this works while demonstrating they have no understanding what titled property is or how it works.

About the best any dealership could do here to control this, without holding a lien, would be a right of first refusal to buy the truck back, if their customer (new owner) chooses to sell within a finite timeframe. And such an agreements really need to be concisely detailed, purposed and with strict timeframes or deadlines and/or pricing. Otherwise it's just for show, or should I say a totally unethical and most likely legally questionable scare tactic... If such a thing were in place and someone sold their truck, the best a dealership could do is to sue that person for breach of contract and they would have to be able to account for real world damages the sale caused to them. Not going to happen. They could never reverse a sale of titled property, the scope of their damages don't extend beyond any terms that are defined in that secondary agreement.

The best/only argument any proponents or validators of a no-resale clause can ever come up with is John Cena and his GT500. Which there was no actual clause dictating a no-resale situation there, either. The problem was that he was an active and sponsored brand ambassador for Ford. He had to coordinate any sales or transfers or promotion of Ford product with Ford's sponsorship team, which he thought he did by sending a couple emails. They sued Cena over breach of contract, claiming that his actions were damaging to Ford's brand image. Not that he sold the car, which they have no right to directly control.
Well, my dealership's GM specifically discussed it with me, from that memo. Which was genuine, and clearly stated sample language.
 

lakeguy55

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I'll be willing to sign a no sale contract once Ford starts enforcing their claims of moving to a no-ADM model and rewarding the dealers who do so.
 

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I'll be willing to sign a no sale contract once Ford starts enforcing their claims of moving to a no-ADM model and rewarding the dealers who do so.
I'd prefer some sort of negative reinforcement for the offending dealers in tandem.
 

metroshot

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July delivery: no ADM, no NO sale clause to deal with.
 

Lime Green

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Well, my dealership's GM specifically discussed it with me, from that memo. Which was genuine, and clearly stated sample language.
Whatever. I'd laugh in their face if a dealership did that to me. I'd call bullshit on it until they showed me a certified and notarized letter from Ford HQ and would still laugh at them after that because it doesn't change how titled property works or vehicle sales laws work. And then if by some miracle they could validate it, I would publicly shame Farley and all the execs at Ford for claiming they were unaware of its existence and allowing their dealerships to unethically bully customers. Your dealership/GM is full of shit. Yes, I'm going there. You're also in MI, where automakers, and more so their dealerships, seem to make all the rules and yet still not play by them much of the time. I'd bet you dinner the guy downloaded the bogus memo or retyped it up on Ford letterhead to make it look official and added some verbiage so they could bully their customers. I buy dozens of vehicles each year, mostly trucks, from two dealerships I talk to regularly. My dealership where I'm getting my Lightning values me as a customer. Enough so that when I complained about the heated steering wheel delete, they were going to retrofit the heated wheel and necessary components for me at no cost. We're taking a wait and see on that now since Ford says they will be offering a retrofit kit for it in '23. ...That retrofit kit is talked about in official Ford communication. The no-resale, example verbiage, whatever, is not. Never was. Doesn't exist. Maybe it exists in Michigan if there's some legal loophole that allows dealerships to maintain some sort of control over property they don't own, but I'd wager not. I'm betting they would have never let you leave the building with a copy of whatever they showed you, even if you signed it.

And we could back this up a bit and acknowledge several states have standardized motor vehicle sales contracts. Which a dealership's own contracts must primarily adhere to. Also those standardized state contracts must be used for a vehicle sale, new or used, if a customer requests it of their dealership. This is the case in CA, NY, CO, AZ and WY. I can't say for states beyond that. And did I mention that titled property exists for a reason. I seem to think I may have mentioned that before...

I have yet to see one credible account of a no-resale clause being used for a Lightning, or any other vehicle for that matter. Put up or shut up, let's see the goods. And even if it somehow does exist, which it does not, it would only be enforceable in some fairy tale fever dream some dealership sales manager cooked up on meth. Far more likely to land a dealership in legal hot water or leave Ford scrambling to wipe a blemish off their branding.
 

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You really have no idea what you're talking about. My GM laughed when he got the memo, he doesn't care what customers do after they buy. It definitely existed in official Ford communication.

https://www.f150lightningforum.com/...resale-provisions-in-purchase-contracts.7961/

A simple Google search reveals many sources reporting the memo. It was posted, then Ford made them take it down.

Anyway, I'm done with this.
 

EdRudy

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I took delivery in Mid November, No ADM and no Sales clause.

It was interesting when I went to pick up my truck they did have a 10K ADM sticker on it, but they said it only applied to others if I refused delivery. I think they were trying to see if I would bite.
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