Tesla fires whole Supercharger team [Update: Musk says supercharger growth will continue]

[Toby57]

I always get a chuckle when people complain about all the tax payer money Tesla gets. Like we forgot about GM getting bailed out from bankruptcy. Or all the money big oil gets.

Just to be fair, the over two year benefits Ford got at the same time..

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[The Weatherman]

Just to be fair, the over two year benefits Ford got at the same time..

To be accurate, if you asyinFord received bailout money at the time GM and Chrysler did , that would be incorrect. Ford reserved their position to accept it, but never drew any bailout.

 

[Toby57]

To be accurate, if you asyinFord received bailout money at the time GM and Chrysler did , that would be incorrect. Ford reserved their position to accept it, but never drew any bailout.

I didn't say Ford drew bailout money. Ford did receive a bailout.
Ford had already taken bids on the new Transit line going in Claycomo plant. (KC)
Ford bailout was that all contractors, all employees, all persons working on the Transit line must take a %10 reduction in pay for duration.
Edit to add job lasted just over two years.

 

[The Weatherman]

I didn't say Ford drew bailout money. Ford did receive a bailout.
Ford had already taken bids on the new Transit line going in Claycomo plant. (KC)
Ford bailout was that all contractors, all employees, all persons working on the Transit line must take a %10 reduction in pay for duration.
Edit to add job lasted just over two years.

That sounds like shrewd negotiation, not taxpayer money. But hey what do I know?

 

[Toby57]

That sounds like shrewd negotiation, not taxpayer money. But hey what do I know?

Shrewd negotiation, oh heck yes. But political.
See how much it is going to cost to put in this transit line. You helped GM, how much tax payer help can we get? The above was the political answer.

 

[ctuan13]

I always get a chuckle when people complain about all the tax payer money Tesla gets. Like we forgot about GM getting bailed out from bankruptcy. Or all the money big oil gets.

Oh I didn't forget about that. GM and Chrysler should have been allowed to fail, plain and simple. The government simply rewarded them for their poor financial management. Oh and they were pissed when they couldn't buy out Ford.

 

[ctuan13]

Boy how times change! Just a few months ago when there was talk of about adopting the NACS standard, I and others were ridiculed when we said not to trust Tesla. Now it sounds like everyone is on board the Tesla hate train.

Just to be clear, I wanted to steer clear of anything Tesla but I was reluctantly willing to use the Superchargers since NEVI hasn’t come through as promised. Now it sounds like Tesla is abandoning the Supercharger support and reliability won’t be any better than an other service provider. Now I’m back to hoping the teeth in NEVI will keep the chargers working.

If Tesla abandons support for NACS chargers what will happen to all the plans of other manufacturers to adopt NACS? Are there royalty payments other manufacturers won’t have to pay if they don’t adopt NACS? Is the only reason other manufacturers wanted to adopt NACS was so they would have access to an existing (now abandoned) charging network?

I have to admit that getting all the other manufacturers to adopt NACS and then abandoning NACS build out is a very smart business tactic. I don’t know about all the other states but Texas passed regulations requiring all the NEVI chargers to have NACS ports so why would Tesla want to spend the money to build out the NACS network themselves? Who says Tesla isn’t a predatory business?

Oh yeah, I don't remember if I posted much about it here, but from the beginning, I was highly skeptical of the idea of making the Tesla connector the standard, from the moment Aptera first announced the idea.

Regardless of it being open-source and all, it doesn't change the fact that a single company owns 99.9% of the charging infrastructure with that connector and until all the other charging networks switch over their hardware to Tesla connectors (which could take up to a decade) all vehicles that ship with a NACS port would be at the mercy of the Tesla network for charging.

Even before any of this craziness, back when everyone thought of the Supercharger network as the best thing since sliced bread, I was very wary of a single company controlling all the charging for a standard. And this news and uncertainty only validates my concerns.

I hope things still move forward, but I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if Ford and GM indefinitely delay their transition to native NACS charging and certain automakers completely reverse course and revert to CCS1.

 

[Frankhpns]

NYTimes report

“If you would have told me a month ago that Tesla was a company that would notify people, some with 10-plus years of experience, who helped build the company to what it is today with nothing more than a ‘Dear Employee’ email in middle of the night,” Lane Chaplin, a former employee of the charging unit, wrote on LinkedIn, “I would have said you’re nuts.”

I would not trust Musk as far as I through a Tesla. I believe he is about to sell the Super Charger network to the federal goverment prior to the election to meet Bidens claim that he will install 500,000 EV charge stations by 2030.

 

[BlueLightning]

It’s all fun and games, until people’s livelihood are at stake?!

Is no one safe under the leadership of Musk?

$25k car, 10% staff, Supercharging, Gigapress, etc. all “Canned.”

No wonder top execs leave for other work.

 

[StrikesTwice]

https://www.theverge.com/2021/10/22...-blue-oval-city-incentive-package-884-million

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/b...ry-plant-strategic-fund-marshall/69899571007/

Ford’s no different than the rest. Automotive companies love their welfare.

 

[Pioneer74]

I didn't say Ford drew bailout money. Ford did receive a bailout.
Ford had already taken bids on the new Transit line going in Claycomo plant. (KC)
Ford bailout was that all contractors, all employees, all persons working on the Transit line must take a %10 reduction in pay for duration.
Edit to add job lasted just over two years.

How is renegotiating a private contract a bailout?

 

[Grease Lightning]

NOBODY KNOWS ANYTHING

I know stuff…Elon is an 🫏 , but I already knew that

 

[Hammick]

I have a lot of thoughts on this one

• With Tesla sales through the floor, I would not be surprised if Elon is putting blame to opening up the Supercharger network for the fall in Tesla car demand. I don't think that Elon ever really wanted to do this. He just wanted the tax dollars. The departure of Supercharger leadership certainly suggests this.
• While Ford and Rivian have access and I don't see that going away, it's already obvious that other automakers are in a lurch. There are no specific dates for any of the other OEMs on the calendar. With the Supercharger team gone, Tesla is going to drag their feet on any additional OEM support. I wouldn't be surprised to see them wriggle out of agreements with other automakers.
• I went to check the status of my free NACS adapter this morning and it resulted in a page error. The recent delays in adapter production/shipments are all on Tesla. I don't expect my free adapter to show up anytime soon. I think that we can fully expect Tesla to slow roll additional adapters for Ford and Rivian owners.
• It's entirely possible that Tesla doesn't want to be in the charging business. It's incredibly expensive to build out the capacity and capability. Getting other charging networks to adopt NACS helps get them off the hook to keep building out their own network. The announcement hints at this as it doesn't sound like they're going to be doing any new Supercharger sites not already started.
• Given that they're not doing new sites, it's now highly unlikely that the existing V2 chargers will be upgraded to V3 or V4 as Tesla has suggested in the past.
• Tesla Supercharger reliability has nothing to do with magic components, etc. Their maintenance program has been super aggressive. I have encountered broken superchargers that get fixed quickly. This dramatic cut suggests that Tesla is scaling back on that day-to-day support. I'd expect more issues going forward. We all remember what Electrify America was like back when they weren't doing regular maintenance.

Surely the FED and Ford have specific provisions in the contract that V2 stations had to be upgraded, a time frame for upgrades and penalties if it doesn't happen.

 

[Toby57]

How is renegotiating a private contract a bailout?

No contracts were renegotiated. Contracts were in and accepted Oct. 2009. In 2010 the Missouri Manufacturing Jobs act was passed. The very next day, Ford said it would put in the Transit line.
That way the gov and Ford come out looking shiny.
The gov gave away no tax dollars, Ford took no tax dollars, except for the few thousands that put in the line.
I do not take it well when folks paint manufacturers with a bad brush while painting ford with an innocent brush.

 

[Pioneer74]

No contracts were renegotiated. Contracts were in and accepted Oct. 2009. In 2010 the Missouri Manufacturing Jobs act was passed. The very next day, Ford said it would put in the Transit line.
That way the gov and Ford come out looking shiny.
The gov gave away no tax dollars, Ford took no tax dollars, except for the few thousands that put in the line.
I do not take it well when folks paint manufacturers with a bad brush while painting ford with an innocent brush.

And you consider that a bailout?

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