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world2steven

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I don’t know what is ‘fair’ but calculating a license tax for a Lightning or any electric vehicle using the MSRP isn’t. Entirely aside from all the ‘externalities’, e.g. global warming, wars, damaged health etc, an EV still costs anywhere from 1/3rd to ½ more than the equivalent ICE vehicle. Do any other states still have preferential license tax rates for EVs?
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rdr854

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I don’t know what is ‘fair’ but calculating a license tax for a Lightning or any electric vehicle using the MSRP isn’t. Entirely aside from all the ‘externalities’, e.g. global warming, wars, damaged health etc, an EV still costs anywhere from 1/3rd to ½ more than the equivalent ICE vehicle. Do any other states still have preferential license tax rates for EVs?
Yes. Virginia surcharges BEVs as well fuel efficient vehicles, which is defined as as any vehicle with a combined mpg of at least 25 mpg. The theory is that BEVs and fuel efficient vehicles are not paying their fair share of gas taxes.
 

shutterbug

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I don’t know what is ‘fair’ but calculating a license tax for a Lightning or any electric vehicle using the MSRP isn’t. Entirely aside from all the ‘externalities’, e.g. global warming, wars, damaged health etc, an EV still costs anywhere from 1/3rd to ½ more than the equivalent ICE vehicle. Do any other states still have preferential license tax rates for EVs?
From what I've seen a handful of states have an additional fees for registering EVs.
 

VTbuckeye

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I don't have a problem paying a bit more for EVs and other fuel efficient vehicles so long as it is proportional to use. Our household has three vehicles. Between the three we go in less than 20k miles per year. My parents are in a similar position. My sister and her husband travel that much between two cars in 6 months. A flat fee is great for them and really bad for us. Yes we use the roads and should pay fees/tax for them, but a flat fee is not the best way.
 

Nick Gerteis

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Mississippi charges $150 extra per year for EV registration, which I’m happy to pay since it’s going to road maintenance. BUT with many states currently proposing temporary fuel tax holidays or rebates, it would only be fair to extend a commensurate reduction in registration fees in those places that charge EVs extra. Now how did I get so far off topic?
 

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greenne

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Yes. Virginia surcharges BEVs as well fuel efficient vehicles, which is defined as as any vehicle with a combined mpg of at least 25 mpg. The theory is that BEVs and fuel efficient vehicles are not paying their fair share of gas taxes.
Buying an EV is one of the only times living in a BLUE state is an advantage economically-- New York still encouraging EVs...
 

greenne

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Mississippi charges $150 extra per year for EV registration, which I’m happy to pay since it’s going to road maintenance. BUT with many states currently proposing temporary fuel tax holidays or rebates, it would only be fair to extend a commensurate reduction in registration fees in those places that charge EVs extra. Now how did I get so far off topic?
If things were really "fair", road maintenance would be primarily paid for either by usage or by weight. Trucks and heavy vehicles cause more damage than a fuel efficient subcompact. In the past it was convenient that heavier vehicles had larger engines that used more fuel so the fuel tax works. Fuel efficient EVs turn that on its head-- additional taxes or fees on EVs not only unfair, but counterproductive.
 

vandy1981

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If things were really "fair", road maintenance would be primarily paid for either by usage or by weight. Trucks and heavy vehicles cause more damage than a fuel efficient subcompact. In the past it was convenient that heavier vehicles had larger engines that used more fuel so the fuel tax works. Fuel efficient EVs turn that on its head-- additional taxes or fees on EVs not only unfair, but counterproductive.
This is a key point. It's insane that a Hummer EV should pay the same road tax as a Bolt EV. I hope we'll start seeing registration based on curb weight. I thinkt that's more equitable and would create more incentive for manufactures to produce lighter EVs.

The most equitable tax would be based on mileage, but that raises privacy and enforcement issues in the Land of the Free.
 

sotek2345

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Buying an EV is one of the only times living in a BLUE state is an advantage economically-- New York still encouraging EVs...
To a point - but they could do more. Anything with an MSRP over$40k (so almost everything) only gets a $500 tax credit. They have worked to get DC fast chargers at thruway rest stops, but most are limited to 50kW.
 

greenne

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To a point - but they could do more. Anything with an MSRP over$40k (so almost everything) only gets a $500 tax credit. They have worked to get DC fast chargers at thruway rest stops, but most are limited to 50kW.
Oh they can do a lot more--the $40k restriction is a joke. However don't be surprised if the Lightning qualifies on a technicality. The MSRP "cap" for the NYS tax credit is based on the base trim MSRP. So the VW id4 qualifies--all trims--even if the awd is closer to $50. If they consider the pro the same Model as Lightning..then it will get the full $200 since the pro is under the cap.

Crazy.

But at least they are not doing that registration surcharge BS...
 

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Nick Gerteis

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This is a key point. It's insane that a Hummer EV should pay the same road tax as a Bolt EV. I hope we'll start seeing registration based on curb weight. I thinkt that's more equitable and would create more incentive for manufactures to produce lighter EVs.

The most equitable tax would be based on mileage, but that raises privacy and enforcement issues in the Land of the Free.
Both you and Greene are correct, and if taxes/registration fees accurately reflected the road damage from each vehicle, big rig 18 wheelers would probably have to pay 95% of the total: they drive much more, and their weight harms roads much more. Trucking companies would raise prices, and it would, in effect, become another version of a sales tax or consumption tax. Worth a try, but politically probably a non starter.
 

sotek2345

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Oh they can do a lot more--the $40k restriction is a joke. However don't be surprised if the Lightning qualifies on a technicality. The MSRP "cap" for the NYS tax credit is based on the base trim MSRP. So the VW id4 qualifies--all trims--even if the awd is closer to $50. If they consider the pro the same Model as Lightning..then it will get the full $200 since the pro is under the cap.

Crazy.

But at least they are not doing that registration surcharge BS...
Wasn't aware of that - thanks. We just got the $500 for our Mach-e an I didn't look that close.
 

greenne

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Wasn't aware of that - thanks. We just got the $500 for our Mach-e an I didn't look that close.
Yes the Id4 is an example....if you read "between the lines" in the regulation a more expensive trim is fair game if the "base" msrp is below $42k (I think the Mach E is barely above). So in theory the Lightning and Silverado EVs should get the full NYS credit as both have a base MSRP below $42k.

Same thing for the Fisker Ocean as the base model will be $37k even though the upper trims can approach $68k.
 

TaxmanHog

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Both you and Greene are correct, and if taxes/registration fees accurately reflected the road damage from each vehicle, big rig 18 wheelers would probably have to pay 95% of the total: they drive much more, and their weight harms roads much more. Trucking companies would raise prices, and it would, in effect, become another version of a sales tax or consumption tax. Worth a try, but politically probably a non starter.
75,000# trucks are already paying the Federal Government $550 a year per truck to roll this is in addition to the road/fuel stamps they pay for states they travel through, yup your head of lettuce and other household commodities are going up not only for the cost of fuel but every greenies dream of over taxing the transportation sector.

See the form 2290 for details about this tax they pay....
https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f2290.pdf
 

Nick Gerteis

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75,000# trucks are already paying the Federal Government $550 a year per truck to roll this is in addition to the road/fuel stamps they pay for states they travel through, yup your head of lettuce and other household commodities are going up not only for the cost of fuel but every greenies dream of over taxing the transportation sector.

See the form 2290 for details about this tax they pay....
https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f2290.pdf
Thank you for pointing that out, I’ve seen this subject discussed several times in EV forums before, and never seen this tax mentioned. Good to have all different voices at the table!
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