Silly Complaint - No Auto Down/Up Rear Windows

[Nate977p]

I had to post this, as it is such a silly complaint. But for this price point, it is crazy the rear windows are not auto down/up, ateast in the Lariat.

My base '99 Passat had all 4 auto down/up!

/Rant

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[ericpullen]

You know, I just noticed this today and thought it was odd as well. My 2020 Expedition has auto rear windows, so what gives?

 

[PungoteagueDave]

Bunch of reasons, but there are reasons. Blame lawyers and socialist government regulators, especially EU. https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/why-car-power-windows-work-differently/

 

[skiborsy]

Bunch of reasons, but there are reasons. Blame lawyers and socialist government regulators, especially EU. https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/why-car-power-windows-work-differently/

None of this really answers why Ford thinks they're ok in the Bronco and Expedition, but not the F-150. Edit to add: Ram also doesn't have them in the rear, so wonder whether there's some truck-specific reason (other than that trucks span a ridiculously wide price range per model).

 

[Pioneer74]

None of this really answers why Ford thinks they're ok in the Bronco and Expedition, but not the F-150. Edit to add: Ram also doesn't have them in the rear, so wonder whether there's some truck-specific reason (other than that trucks span a ridiculously wide price range per model).

They've never been on the F150 before.

I'm just happy that you can unlock and lock from the outside on the rear doors on the Lariat. The ICE trucks don't have that feature.

 

[PopsGG]

A long time ago auto makers took a shot at making Luxury trucks, they failed to get traction.

Lincoln Mark LT
Cadillac Escalade EXT

Why did they fail? The same testosterone filled macho man beasts that want trucks, didn't want to be caught dead in a fancy luxury car. So auto makers got smart. Why not make normal trucks, but fill them with luxury options? BOOM next thing you know truck prices more than doubled in a few years.

The problem is, when you are starting with a cheap work truck, there is only so much you can do to fancy it up. You can put lipstick on a pig, but its still a pig. To keep manufacturing cheap they do not make a lot of changes to the basic platform, they just add in big ticket items but keep the simple stuff the same. $10,000 for massaging seats anyone?

I have said it before, you cannot find a 90k car that looks anything like high end trucks on the inside these days. The difference is night and day. A high end truck is just not a great value.

https://www.autotrader.com/car-news/heres-why-luxury-brand-trucks-failed-281474979905302

 

[jerock]

My Silverado doesn’t have them either. So now I know it’s because of a socialist conspiracy!!

 

[PungoteagueDave]

A long time ago auto makers took a shot at making Luxury trucks, they failed to get traction.

Lincoln Mark LT
Cadillac Escalade EXT

Why did they fail? The same testosterone filled macho man beasts that want trucks, didn't want to be caught dead in a fancy luxury car. So auto makers got smart. Why not make normal trucks, but fill them with luxury options? BOOM next thing you know truck prices more than doubled in a few years.

The problem is, when you are starting with a cheap work truck, there is only so much you can do to fancy it up. You can put lipstick on a pig, but its still a pig. To keep manufacturing cheap they do not make a lot of changes to the basic platform, they just add in big ticket items but keep the simple stuff the same. $10,000 for massaging seats anyone?

I have said it before, you cannot find a 90k car that looks anything like high end trucks on the inside these days. The difference is night and day. A high end truck is just not a great value.

https://www.autotrader.com/car-news/heres-why-luxury-brand-trucks-failed-281474979905302

Really? I'm trading in my '21 PowerBoost to the selling dealer with 12k miles on it for $2k more than I paid for it in May '21. That truck has more content than any of my four prior or current Teslas or my wife's Porsche, all of which cost significantly more than it's original $82k list or $77k selling price. My Lightning at $95k seems like a bargain. Stupid expensive but everything is relative.

 

[FlasherZ]

My kids brought it up the other day, they're used to auto-down and auto-up on our other cars. I kinda wish they'd have auto on all four doors.

 

[PopsGG]

Really? I'm trading in my '21 PowerBoost to the selling dealer with 12k miles on it for $2k more than I paid for it in May '21. That truck has more content than any of my four prior or current Teslas or my wife's Porsche, all of which cost significantly more than it's original $82k list or $77k selling price. My Lightning at $95k seems like a bargain. Stupid expensive but everything is relative.

Yes really. There is a reason trucks are the highest profit margin vehicles for Ford, GM and Chrystler(Stalantis or whatever they are called now). You get less for more. If your vehicle sells for more than you bought it that is not relevant to if it was a good value, considering you would still need to purchase another one. Plus I imagine one day the market will return to normal.

Tesla isn't a fair comparison, there was a deliberate choice to make the car as minimalist as possible.

I can build a Porsche with a better more fully featured interior than a F150 if you like. @ $90k

edit: Just to be clear, my point isnt that you cant get a car for over 90k that has less features than a F150. ie Lamborghini. Its that for the top end price of a F150, most other vehicles have a much nicer interior with more features. ... also I love my F150 dispite this.

 

[PungoteagueDave]

Yes really. There is a reason trucks are the highest profit margin vehicles for Ford, GM and Chrystler(Stalantis or whatever they are called now). You get less for more. If your vehicle sells for more than you bought it that is not relevant to if it was a good value, considering you would still need to purchase another one. Plus I imagine one day the market will return to normal.

Tesla isn't a fair comparison, there was a deliberate choice to make the car as minimalist as possible.

I can build a Porsche with a better more fully featured interior than a F150 if you like.

The fact that they have solid profit margins (still nowhere near that of Porsche or Tesla, which have the second and first gross profit margins in the automotive business, respectively) is irrelevant to value. The fact that the F-150 is the best selling vehicle in the U.S. every year is all we need to know about value. The consumer votes with its pocketbook and the result is pretty clear.

I have owned a dozen Ford trucks, get more value from them than I do/did from my BMWs, Benzes, Teslas, Porsches, etc. Enjoyed them all, but value is a relative game. When Ford has a waiting list for $90k trucks, and there are none on the dealer lots, it is pretty clear that the value metric is working. This is not just a current phenomenon - it has been going on for decades at this point - pushed to extremes more recently - and they have not been able to find a top despite valiant attempts to test the greater fool theory beyond what many thought possible. So we now have massagers and fold-flat seats, self-weighing suspensions, etc., when we got along just fine without them - but that is still content and worth paying for if you enjoy it.

Life has gotten dramatically better in ways that we cannot measure financially - and the safety of our vehicles is just one element. Is is possible to put a price on the internet and what it has done to our lives? Streaming media? Connected cars? Seeing our kids/grandkids onscreen in real time while travelling overseas? Priceless stuff. It is everywhere - and that content is in our trucks too. There is no price that I can put on the fact that my son, a Navy pilot deployed overseas, can skype every night with his kids almost as though he is sitting next to them, read them a story while Mom flips the pages. That level of tech lives inside every Ford truck from top to bottom, and in most other brands' vehicles - and we aren't paying anywhere near the incremental value of teh improvements compared to how much they've changed since 2010, much less 1990 or 1960.

 

[PopsGG]

@PungoteagueDave I pretty much agree with everything you said. Life is good.

I am trying to address the original question on this thread. Why is such an expensive vehicle lacking features common in comparably priced vehicles? If you want a fancy schmancy interior on a vehicle, A F150 isnt a good value. If you want the truck as a whole and all it has to offer, its a much better value proposition.

 

[EVTruckGuy]

The fact that they have solid profit margins (still nowhere near that of Porsche or Tesla, which have the second and first gross profit margins in the automotive business, respectively) is irrelevant to value. The fact that the F-150 is the best selling vehicle in the U.S. every year is all we need to know about value. The consumer votes with its pocketbook and the result is pretty clear.

I have owned a dozen Ford trucks, get more value from them than I do/did from my BMWs, Benzes, Teslas, Porsches, etc. Enjoyed them all, but value is a relative game. When Ford has a waiting list for $90k trucks, and there are none on the dealer lots, it is pretty clear that the value metric is working. This is not just a current phenomenon - it has been going on for decades at this point - pushed to extremes more recently - and they have not been able to find a top despite valiant attempts to test the greater fool theory beyond what many thought possible. So we now have massagers and fold-flat seats, self-weighing suspensions, etc., when we got along just fine without them - but that is still content and worth paying for if you enjoy it.

Life has gotten dramatically better in ways that we cannot measure financially - and the safety of our vehicles is just one element. Is is possible to put a price on the internet and what it has done to our lives? Streaming media? Connected cars? Seeing our kids/grandkids onscreen in real time while travelling overseas? Priceless stuff. It is everywhere - and that content is in our trucks too. There is no price that I can put on the fact that my son, a Navy pilot deployed overseas, can skype every night with his kids almost as though he is sitting next to them, read them a story while Mom flips the pages. That level of tech lives inside every Ford truck from top to bottom, and in most other brands' vehicles - and we aren't paying anywhere near the incremental value of teh improvements compared to how much they've changed since 2010, much less 1990 or 1960.

I don't think you 2 are even talking about the same thing anymore.

PopsGGi is correctly pointing out that nearly every $90k vehicle on the road has a more high end look and feel that the Lightning. That's not completely subjective as you are stating. It's more than an opinion.

You can't argue the point that the vast majority of $90k cars have much less plastic on the trim and dash than the Lightning, have auto up/down windows all around, and have lot more wood and leather trim in them than the Lightning. Those are facts.

Is the Lightning a good value overall? Well... That's a different story. It has a lot of technology and features you can't find in other trucks. I think it's a decent value considering no other vehicle can do everything the Lightning does. That doesn't change the fact that for the same price most other cars are "nicer" in a luxery look and feel sort of way.

 

[Amps]

I prefer not having auto-up/down rear windows because it is easier to crack them slightly open for a cross breeze without buffeting.

 

[FlasherZ]

I prefer not having auto-up/down rear windows because it is easier to crack them slightly open for a cross breeze without buffeting.

I can do that on the Tesla as well, you just don't push down the window button past the detent that signals express down/up. Just gently press the button, it goes down as far as you want to go. Push down further until it "clicks" and you get window full-down.

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