80A EVSE, Ford Charge Station Pro, versus other options?

[cdherman]

I see people selling them for 700-850. An 80A EVSE costs more like $1400-1600 from most others. So the $1300 list price is fair, but are people having trouble with the ford units? I am very handy -- already installed a 48A Emporia, but used 4 g copper for the 20' run, which should be ok for 80A. I heard Ford says 3 g, but I have a short run from the subpanel (125A sub, fed by 1 gauge copper from my 200A main)

And, I seem to have read that I will NOT get a Ford Charge Station Pro with my newly ordered Lariat ER. I had/have an XLT SR ordered before the price drop, which of course had no need for 80A. Installed the 48A ahead of time, but planned for future upgrades.

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[sotek2345]

It isn't a great unit, but mine has been mostly acceptable. The cover loves to fall off (I need to fix it about once a week), and I have had to call Ford to do a remote reset on it once because it had completely locked up.

A couple points:

If you are looking for any type of meaningful smart data off of it - forget it. Everything you can pull out of Fordpass is garbage.

Other have had issues with it overheating when running at the full 80A, or even 72A.

Lots of folks have issues with the home backup solution, but that seems to be mostly on the Sunrun kit vs. the EVSE.

I have mine derated to 48A, and as a 48A dumb charger it works fine. I would never have bought or installed it if it hadn't come with the truck though. Much prefer the Grizzl-e we have installed in parallel.

 

[The Weatherman]

I have the Ford Pro installed and run it at full throttle as 80A charger. It is not on the net and is totally a ‘dumb’ setup. It has worked flawlessly for the past 3 months.

It came with my 2022 Er Lariat Demo I bought in April.

 

[Maquis]

I see people selling them for 700-850. An 80A EVSE costs more like $1400-1600 from most others. So the $1300 list price is fair, but are people having trouble with the ford units? I am very handy -- already installed a 48A Emporia, but used 4 g copper for the 20' run, which should be ok for 80A. I heard Ford says 3 g, but I have a short run from the subpanel (125A sub, fed by 1 gauge copper from my 200A main)

And, I seem to have read that I will NOT get a Ford Charge Station Pro with my newly ordered Lariat ER. I had/have an XLT SR ordered before the price drop, which of course had no need for 80A. Installed the 48A ahead of time, but planned for future upgrades.

Per the NEC, EVSE branch circuits must be sized at not less than 125% of the EVSE rating. So an 80A EVSE would require a 100A branch circuit, which equates to #3 THHN copper. You can’t use #4.

 

[cdherman]

Does the Ford Charge Station Pro allow the end user to derate the unit on one's own? Nassau National Cable is where I bought my run of 4-4-4-6 and their website says 4 copper is OK for sub-panel of 100A under 50' from main. So I assumed that it would be OK for a branch circuit too. But using some voltage drop calculators -- they are saying 3 as well.

I might have even did that calculation and decided that an 80A branch was good enough for future proofing. When I was planning, I was getting just a SR with 10.8kw max charging capacity, so I was oversizing from the 6 that would have been enough for a 60A branch.

Anyone know the answer to the question if ER trucks are still getting the FCSP for free still?

 

[Warp Asylum]

Anyone know the answer to the question if ER trucks are still getting the FCSP for free still?

The mobile charger is a $500 option, but as far as I know, the FCSP is still being provided for ER trucks. The Platinum I had on order before I bought the 22 definitely would've gotten it. In fact, Sunrun contacted me about it shortly before I cancelled the order.

For the record, I use a Chargepoint HomeFlex at 48A that we installed last year for our Mach-E. Other than a software hiccup a few weeks ago, it has been solid and is plenty fast enough to charge the truck.

 

[Maquis]

Does the Ford Charge Station Pro allow the end user to derate the unit on one's own? Nassau National Cable is where I bought my run of 4-4-4-6 and their website says 4 copper is OK for sub-panel of 100A under 50' from main. So I assumed that it would be OK for a branch circuit too. But using some voltage drop calculators -- they are saying 3 as well.

I might have even did that calculation and decided that an 80A branch was good enough for future proofing. When I was planning, I was getting just a SR with 10.8kw max charging capacity, so I was oversizing from the 6 that would have been enough for a 60A branch.

Anyone know the answer to the question if ER trucks are still getting the FCSP for free still?

Yes, there is a switch in the CSP that can set the max output for installation on a lesser branch circuit. Set to 64A for an 80A circuit, for example.

There are subtle differences in wire sizing between panel feeders and branch circuits.

 

[Pioneer74]

Does the Ford Charge Station Pro allow the end user to derate the unit on one's own? Nassau National Cable is where I bought my run of 4-4-4-6 and their website says 4 copper is OK for sub-panel of 100A under 50' from main. So I assumed that it would be OK for a branch circuit too. But using some voltage drop calculators -- they are saying 3 as well.

I might have even did that calculation and decided that an 80A branch was good enough for future proofing. When I was planning, I was getting just a SR with 10.8kw max charging capacity, so I was oversizing from the 6 that would have been enough for a 60A branch.

Anyone know the answer to the question if ER trucks are still getting the FCSP for free still?

4-4-4-6 may be good for a 100A sub panel, but a sub panel isn't a continuous load. That is why you need #3.

You can derate the charger to 64 amps and be good. The ER trucks still receive the FCSP per the order guide. I wouldn't spend the money to upgrade your conductors for the other 16 amps. It's not worth it.

 

[cdherman]

Kinda wish I had paid more attention. 45 feet of 3-3-3-5 versus 4-4-4-6 is $100 difference. Oh well. The circuit is coming off a 125A sub with 1 g wiring, so if I had went with 100A, it would have pretty much maxed out the sub panel. I put in the sub panel so that we could put in a driveway EVSE and an EVSE inside down the road as well, depending on needs. Currently, vehicle that gets parked in garage is ICE. But I think things will change.......

 

[Maquis]

EVSEs don’t require a neutral. If you ran conduit, you could have pulled 2-#3s and a #8 ground.

 

[Henry Ford]

I have two FCSPs. One is set to 32 amps because the circuit left over by the previous owner of my house was only 40 amps and it would be a huge pain to upgrade. It works fine for my needs. The second charger is on a 100 amp circuit but there's no internet access and I wasn't able to get it to update the software using my phone's hotspot. At any rate, it faulted once so I derated it to 64 amps and haven't had trouble since.

I thought I read that the FCSP was optional after the price decrease. If that's the case, for @cdherman I'd recommend picking up a used FCSP from someone on a forum and setting it to 64 amps on your 80 amps circuit. If you want bells and whistles there's probably a better option.

 

[jpepper07]

I fried my first fcsp because the hot wire loosened up caused it to overheat. Just bought another for 660 shipped and installed it making sure I torqued the lugs properly to 60 inch lbs. I also dearated it to 48 amps to be careful and will move it to 64 amps soon. Doubt I will do a full 80amps to avoid risk.

 

[cdherman]

EVSEs don’t require a neutral. If you ran conduit, you could have pulled 2-#3s and a #8 ground.

I am aware, but service entry cable is priced such that it is the same price and less trouble than conduit plus only three wires. Down the road, who knows. Ask the folks that wired their stoves with three wires how they feel about it today.......

For $100, I'd rather have just plain SEC and no conduit. But I am older and have never really learned to use conduit. PVC conduit is fine I suppose, metal is better. I know. Every year removes ones willingness to learn new skills.....

 

[Maquis]

I am aware, but service entry cable is priced such that it is the same price and less trouble than conduit plus only three wires. Down the road, who knows. Ask the folks that wired their stoves with three wires how they feel about it today.......

For $100, I'd rather have just plain SEC and no conduit. But I am older and have never really learned to use conduit. PVC conduit is fine I suppose, metal is better. I know. Every year removes ones willingness to learn new skills.....

All fair points, except the stove example is not analogous. The lacking wire was the ground, not the neutral. Back then, nothing had a separate ground.

 

[cdherman]

EVSEs don’t require a neutral. If you ran conduit, you could have pulled 2-#3s and a #8 ground.

Wanted to future proof. Used Service Entrance Wire. I know you are correct about the neutral, now. But in the future? Dunno. The service entrance wire seemed affordable and allowed me to avoid conduit.

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