Anyone getting Concerned that Ford is not in on EV for the long haul

[earlyadopt]

Hello to everyone in the forum

I am a bit of a junky for EV news, developments and new Tech. It will not come to anyones surprise that there has been a bit of a push back with the transition to EV. Loads of mis-information by people that have no clue about what they are talking about. Most probably either don't own one or bought one with the wrong spec or application. IE they haul heavy and travel long distances the majority of the time.

Any rate I will get to the point now, driving an EV is pretty much driving a computer that gets you from A to B efficiently. The fact it is a computer and by changing software, things can become more efficient and useable. Tesla has demonstrated just how much they can improve on older models efficiency by changing the software that runs the car. They can even add new features with an upload. Long term longevity with Tesla is not in question.

This brings me to FORD, Ford has made some rather large retreats in this segment of the market. They have either dropped future projects or delayed them by years. So looking at FORD now as a future EV company, I am having doubts. I lease 2 vehicles from FORD, MachE and Lightning. The MachE will go back at the end of the lease ( I figure I will be able to buy a new car for the price of the residual). With the Lightning, I was planning to keep it for it utility nature of the car and since it is electric, it will have a long life left in 4 yrs. Here's my challenge, I was going to buy it out after the first month of the lease and save the interest and call it a day.
Now with all the moves Ford is making in a negative way, I am not sure that they will either be around to service the vehicle or keep the software improvements happening. Software with Ford is not their best quality. This is not by any means a FORD bash, heck I leased 2 of them.

Any thoughts or insights??

Did I make the wrong decision and jump onto the wrong horse??

Cheers!

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[potato]

Personally I don't care about Ford's future plans. Sure, it would be nice if they were cranking out new and exciting products every year, but bottom line I just need them to stay in business to support the Lightning that is sitting in my driveway now.

If they need to scale back EV timelines to stay profitable due to current market sentiment, then so be it. But all it would take is a shock to oil prices and demand for EVs goes back through the roof again. ICEs are kind of living on borrowed time in my opinion.

 

[brewski]

No, but I do think the EV SUV makes sense. It would be another mom-tank that is used to hustle carpool for school and sports. It would be perfect for that.

Additionally, the thought that an EV need to be an entirely new vehicle is off base.
The lighting is a grand example.

 

[earlyadopt]

Personally I don't care about Ford's future plans. Sure, it would be nice if they were cranking out new and exciting products every year, but bottom line I just need them to stay in business to support the Lightning that is sitting in my driveway now.

If they need to scale back EV timelines to stay profitable due to current market sentiment, then so be it. But all it would take is a shock to oil prices and demand for EVs goes back through the roof again. ICEs are kind of living on borrowed time in my opinion.

I agree with your comments on "oil" and "borrowed time". What I would like to see is a little more updates to software that will improve functionality of the truck and efficiencies. Ford has a very expensive battery pack in the truck. I am sure they can get more miles out of it and charging apeed can improve. That said, that part is above my pay grade.

 

[Heliian]

Don't believe anything you read online without proper sources.

Most of the hate is online and it's mostly bot posts and reposts by the undereducated who believe everything they see on Facebook.

Ford has put billions, billions of dollars into their ev's, they're not going anywhere anytime soon.

Sales are up, adoption is up.

I don't plan on ever going back to a gas truck.

 

[00SVT]

I believe I made the right choice. Since Ford’s inception, they have strived to be first, Model T for example.

Even the previous Lightnings did something no else was doing. 1st gen was a sport 1/2 ton- second gen was supercharged and was the spark that led to the catalyst (terminator) of the domestic supercharger wars.

Ford again did this with the Raptor. When the Raptor came out, no one could guess how popular it would be or how it spawn a new segment of factory-built vehicles. It also brought off-roading at speed to the main stream. Crawlling is still held by Jeep.

This truck is not meant to be the techiest, nor have the most range, or the most power. It is meant to be a derivative of their bread and butter. A swiss army knife that doesnt do one thing exceptionally well but is great at many things,

Well there is one thing the Lightning does well as does pretty much many of Ford’s pet projects- they are a hell of a bargain. Price out a Flash- after rebates, tax credit and everything and you will see that nothing touches it. It’s cute when they compare a Rivian or when they compare a corvette to a mustang and never mention the price disparity,

Basically- make these things affordable. Look at the Maverick- again Ford does something first again and creates an entire segment of trucks. If Ford could get out of their own way and make dealers play nice…but that is Ford’s biggest problem.

Dealers will not let customers order- instead they artificially inflate prices by packing on the options and then of course no barebones get sold. If Ford could let customers order direct like Tesla- and no market adjustment- Ford would sell a ton more.

i almost bought a Tesla. At the end if the day Tesla is a good option and the prices have come down. But buying a $80-$100k vehicle is just not something many of us are willing to do. And when you look at the $50k version of the Chevy, Rivian, Tesla, GMC, Dodge- those that have a model in that range are no where near comparable to the Lightning.

 

[Scorpio3d]

Hello to everyone in the forum

I am a bit of a junky for EV news, developments and new Tech. It will not come to anyones surprise that there has been a bit of a push back with the transition to EV. Loads of mis-information by people that have no clue about what they are talking about. Most probably either don't own one or bought one with the wrong spec or application. IE they haul heavy and travel long distances the majority of the time.

Any rate I will get to the point now, driving an EV is pretty much driving a computer that gets you from A to B efficiently. The fact it is a computer and by changing software, things can become more efficient and useable. Tesla has demonstrated just how much they can improve on older models efficiency by changing the software that runs the car. They can even add new features with an upload. Long term longevity with Tesla is not in question.

This brings me to FORD, Ford has made some rather large retreats in this segment of the market. They have either dropped future projects or delayed them by years. So looking at FORD now as a future EV company, I am having doubts. I lease 2 vehicles from FORD, MachE and Lightning. The MachE will go back at the end of the lease ( I figure I will be able to buy a new car for the price of the residual). With the Lightning, I was planning to keep it for it utility nature of the car and since it is electric, it will have a long life left in 4 yrs. Here's my challenge, I was going to buy it out after the first month of the lease and save the interest and call it a day.
Now with all the moves Ford is making in a negative way, I am not sure that they will either be around to service the vehicle or keep the software improvements happening. Software with Ford is not their best quality. This is not by any means a FORD bash, heck I leased 2 of them.

Any thoughts or insights??

Did I make the wrong decision and jump onto the wrong horse??

Cheers!

Long post but necessary to cover all of it…

I have owned and driven many Ford vehicles in my life. This is my first EV and I love it. I think Ford is a little more conservative on their timelines than especially Tesla is, in my opinion, this is the right way to operate. Tesla has historically over promised and under delivered. Not saying they don’t make good vehicles as I have never driven one or owned one, but they are always saying everything’s coming out and it’s always delayed by years not weeks or months! Many things changed from the initial EV hype and I think Ford is being realistic about adoption rates at this point in time. There are advantages and disadvantages to being a legacy auto maker and trying to balance out the transition to EV‘s is difficult for the legacy auto makers. If you look at it, Ford Lightning and Tesla cyber truck had how many orders(reservations)? It was going to take many years for them to produce enough to satisfy all of the reservations but now you can pretty much get one if you want one. Even if I never got another software update, I am driving a pretty damn amazing vehicle as is.
Is that what I hope for?….. No! Is that what I expect?…. No! -Just saying-

I have no insight into the next generation of EV‘s that Ford is working on, but I cannot imagine they are spending billions of dollars(Even though they’ve cut back some of the billions, they are still spending billions) not to have their future products be better than what is currently available! Not just EV but all their vehicles. Technology is changing rapidly they are learning what works and what doesn’t. I mean really I went from a 2016 expedition which had decent tech in it but nothing compared to the 23 lightning, but that is to be expected with a seven year newer vehicle not to mention the EV versus the eco-boost differences, before that I had a 2007 expedition and the difference in it versus the 2016 was pretty amazing as well. Ford is transitioning from what I would call the equivalent of your old landline phones in your house (Some of you may not even know what that is )to what we now all carry around in our pockets.

We are talking about technology Intel leapfrogs AMD, then AMD leapfrogs Intel and so on.
Nvidia leapfrogs AMD and then AMD leapfrogs Nvidia and so on. Apple leapfrogs Samsung, then Samsung leapfrogs Apple and so on.

Will Ford, GM, BMW, Mercedes, Toyota, etc. be able to make this transition and compete with Tesla and Rivian and maybe the Chinese? Who knows what the future holds? I think they will and I think the next generation of EV’s will be better. I think the generation of EV’s after that will be better. I think(as well as hope and pray) they will make this generation of EV‘s better. It will take a lot of time and effort, but I think they will get there and they will get our current vehicles there.

 

[THX1138]

I saw this recent article regarding ford battery factory coming on line next year.
https://fordauthority.com/2024/08/ford-blueoval-sk-battery-plant-will-come-online-in-mid-2025/

I understand EVs have a lot less parts needed to manufacture them and that battery costs need to come down a lot before EVs become more competitive over ICE.

Once battery manufacturing costs come down with better chemistry, EVs will become more prevalent. /$0.02

 

[MJDore]

No, but I do think the EV SUV makes sense. It would be another mom-tank that is used to hustle carpool for school and sports. It would be perfect for that.

They just binned it. https://www.motortrend.com/news/ford-kills-large-3-row-ev-plans-delays-t3-truck/

 

[brewski]

They just binned it. https://www.motortrend.com/news/ford-kills-large-3-row-ev-plans-delays-t3-truck/

I'm aware, that's why I mentioned it.

 

[The Weatherman]

I would say disappointed. Fortunately, I have a very good dealer relationship and their EV tech is top notch so I’m not concerned about future service. I am disappointed that there will not be more to choose from sooner rather than later.

 

[mgmessner89]

We are a bunch of enthusiast here so of course the article that came out today is a wrench in the gears but Ford needs time to "regroup". My buying experience absolutely sucked, the dealerships here did not want to sell me a Lightning, the wanted me to look at the Tremors and Powerboost....I was trading in a Leveled 2019 STX getting 16 MPG, I wasn't looking for another ICE, I have a spare car.

We are in a weird spot where the infrastructure is getting there but not quite yet. I love driving mine around town and charging at home but scared to take trips. I've test a few EA stations here and there and half of the time I get charging errors. I would hate to get stranded 90 miles from home.

I will definitely continue on with Ford EV if they continue to improve

 

[SpaceEVDriver]

I'm not an investor in Ford, so I don't strongly care about their quarterly behaviors except as a study in behavior. As Buffett has said, investors should consider being greedy when others are fearful and fearful when others are greedy. I think Farley is following the herd in fearful behaviors instead of taking advantage of (nearly) all the other EV manufacturers slowing down their investments in electrification of vehicles. The EV conversion is coming and (IMO) if Ford were smart, they would have jumped at the chance to release a bare-bones "commodity" EV like a Taurus, or whatever, as a stepping stone / brand loyalty vehicle into the higher-price, higher-profit EVs like the Mustang and Lightning.

I, personally, have no brand loyalty; every purchase I make is based on what I need and what best meets that need. That said, I am a Ford vehicle owner (Mustang Mach-E and Lightning F-150). We purchased the Fords because they were (are) far and away the best vehicles for our needs and budgets. But we don't worry about the continued existence of Ford.

If Ford disappeared tomorrow, I would be quite sad for their union workers, but otherwise I'm not terribly concerned with the continued existence of the company. The vehicles don't require much in the way of maintenance and most of it I can do myself (and I really don't trust the Ford Dealers to do that maintenance--we still haven't bothered with getting the Mustang's HVBJB replaced in part because the local and regional dealers have been non-responsive). The vehicles work just fine and will continue to work just fine with no software changes.

 

[Grumpy2]

The original plan that Farley laid out with the two companies, one EV, one ICE, would have been a better future for Ford. The Dealers stopped that, and 3/4 of them do not like EV's in general. That is bad news for all of the OEM's.

I believe Direct sales of EV's are a better future due to the lack of on-going maintenance. If Tesla had continued with new models with changed bodies, etc; and most importantly put a sock in Elmo's mouth, they would be in a perfect place now. They have mobile service, a few stores, etc.

As it is, I think the Chinese will put Tesla to shame unless Elmo puts out a new exciting car, which seems unlikely considering their idea of a mainstream truck for the bulk of the public.

 

[Oafy44]

Everyone who “hates “evs are almost to the point not being able to buy a car anyway or will hold on to the car for 20 years and out 5k a year on it then buy the most stripped down version. Yet corporate is bowing to people who won’t even be there to support the next 50 years.

but large/inefficient corporations get pressured into making decisions that only last 5 years before they fire the CEO and hire one that has a “vision” for the future and then once the vision isn’t realized gets fired and the company hires someone else to go a “different path”.

if you read Farleys early articles when he was hired you realize he hasn’t changed much he said he would. Ford has been taking “one off charges” every year and the same ole “efficiency” and “not building cars that lose money” was being said by Fields/ Hacket/ now Farley. While ford is shutting down plants , Tesla is building them. They were really going to put their foot down in 2023 and fix warranty issues!!!! And just had their largest warranty charge off of $800m ——but that’s it! That should be the worst of it !…until next qtr.

IMO Farley will be fired by Q2 of next year and the next CEO will come in and tell everyone what they want to hear.
Truth is ford is too old/ has too much legacy cost and will not grow out of their problems but the board will fire hire people who say they can.

Now we can get hyped about the PR machine that is ford/farley talking about skunk works but it’s just them trying to sell shares to bump the stock price by $.25. Skunk works is nothing more then good ole R&D

I wouldn’t put too much into them “canceling” the 3rd row suv.
The explorer EV is probably already finished and ready and they are just waiting because investors are tired of them losing money. The second gm comes out with a successful SUV (the caddy IQ looks really good) EV they will all the sudden have one ready!

BTW- in my area I saw my first cyber truck about 3 months ago and can already report there’s about as many CTs in my area then Lightning’s which is sad.

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