Lightning Battery Heating

[Pioneer74]

So 48a charging is what it needs to precondition without using any battery?

This is what my Emporia recorded for a preconditioning session. Departure time was 5:45 AM.

 

[Pioneer74]

So does that mean that plugging in with the Ford Mobile Charger will not precondition?

It will work on 240v, but not 120v.

 

[GDN]

It might use shore power, but so many unknowns with this truck still. We still don't know what heater and or how they are heating the battery. Munro should be getting closer with the tear down to help us know for sure. Likely using the same as the cabin heater and it should likely use shore power if needed for that if you are plugged in. I don't know how cold the battery can go or at what temperature they start protecting it.

 

[Firestop]

This is what my Emporia recorded for a preconditioning session. Departure time was 5:45 AM.

@TaxmanHog ’s experience…….

https://www.f150lightningforum.com/forum/threads/lightning-battery-heating.13082/post-277239

Was my logic/math incorrect in the attached post?

 

[vandy1981]

So that brings up the question - do we have any heat loops directed into the battery? From any heat source?

The battery is heated through a resistive (PTC) heating core that's shared with the cabin conditioning system. The battery coolant loop passes through that heating core. You can see it in the Munro overview of the thermal management system but they don't actually point it out themselves.

 

[vandy1981]

That’s a shame and something you think Ford would have added while using Tesla as a standard…. So many misses, I don’t get it.

I'm not convinced that en route preconditioning is as big of a deal on EVs with larger-than-average battery packs like the Lightning. Maybe even counterproductive. The Hummer EV (and I think the R1T) are having some thermal throttling issues when preconditioning because the pack starts to overheat deeper in the pack.

The Lightning's battery coolant loop is overengineered so maybe it could cope better .

Either way, it would be great if they could at least make it an option in the settings.

 

[Firestop]

The battery is heated through a resistive (PTC) heating core that's shared with the cabin conditioning system. The battery coolant loop passes through that heating core. You can see it in the Munro overview of the thermal management system but they don't actually point it out themselves.

I’ve been looking for the Ford Patent filing referenced in my https://www.f150lightningforum.com/forum/threads/lightning-heater-specs.8097/post-272571 post to see if this is the design being used in the Lighting???

 

[Pjlightning]

If all the EVSE's are all occupied for the same concern, I would do a pre-conditioning while stand-alone, then pray that one of the stations will be vacant prior to my departure by an hour or two so I can restore what I burnt earlier, failing that just begin the drive and target a charging event down the road to recover what was lost, hopefully a station will be available once you have reached the optimal SOC for a full charge.

thanks - appreciate the tips. I checked with the front desk and they confirmed I was the only EV staying here, and they encouraged me to just stay plugged in all night because of the cold - regardless of whether I was charging- no one else would be using the spaces anyway. So with my catholic guilt relieved, I’m plugged in for the duration

(p.s. - great meeting in Chicopee last month! We’ll have to do that again. Great crew of people)

 

[Pjlightning]

Its never OK to stay plugged in to a public charger if you don't need the charge to make it to your next destination - ever.

You don't need to be plugged in to protect the battery - the BMS will take care of it. It must be super cold for the truck to need to heat to "protect" the battery. This is likely not happening until you get way below freezing and dangerous territories for the battery.

If you are at home or have a dedicated plug and it is cold - then plug in and it'll use the shore power vs battery power to protect itself.

I hear ya 100% and appreciate the feedback - this is all new to me. Still learning the ropes. The spirit of your point was the heart of my concern - I want to be a “good EV citizen” and not tick anyone off through my naivety. Luckily in this case, it’s not quite a “public charger” but an amenity of the resort - and I’m the only EV here so they totally blessed and encouraged me to stay put, plugged in overnight.
But I get your point 100%. And appreciate the message.
thanks

 

[Pioneer74]

@TaxmanHog ’s experience…….

https://www.f150lightningforum.com/forum/threads/lightning-battery-heating.13082/post-277239

Was my logic/math incorrect in the attached post?

Well, his and my data is different. I didn't crunch the numbers. I was just posting what I've observed. I think his truck is in an unattached garage, mine is attached and stays warmer. My experience used less energy but it does show that it only used 26 of 48 available volts for the preconditioning cycle. That should be the target setting of people that want to maintain a minimum voltage setting, but also want to precondition.

I will say this, I'm glad I sprung for an Emporia energy management system for my FCSP. The data Ford gives you is very inadequate.

 

[Firestop]

Well, his and my data is different. I didn't crunch the numbers. I was just posting what I've observed. I think his truck is in an unattached garage, mine is attached and stays warmer. My experience used less energy but it does show that it only used 26 of 48 available volts for the preconditioning cycle. That should be the target setting of people that want to maintain a minimum voltage setting, but also want to precondition.

I will say this, I'm glad I sprung for an Emporia energy management system for my FCSP. The data Ford gives you is very inadequate.

It is all good data to see….thx for providing yours. My truck is parked outside for the next couple of weeks due to waiting on garage door failure repairs. Your collective data reporting has motivated me to set up a couple of preconditioning trials in the near future monitored by my CarScanner App. Yes, to be nice, Ford has a ways to go

 

[Grencola]

I park in the garage with an L2 32A EVSE and keep my max charge at 80% and plug in every night over the winter. During the pre-conditioning phase it almost always stays at 80%. The odd cold night that was -15C, where my garage cooled right down to just above freezing, it 'prepared for the drive' and dipped to 78% then charged for a few minutes back up to 80% and then began conditioning the cab to be warm. So basically if the battery is quite cold then it needs more than 32A to warm up, since it pulls a bit from the battery too. Also even if your departure time happens outside of your preferred charging times it will still charge back up to your desired charge level after warming the battery, which could end up costing more if you're on a time-of-use billing.

side note: I'd sure love a 'skip charging until x % reached' slider to just let it run down my battery a bit each day as I sometimes only go for short drives to nearby jobsites. I'd still stay plugged in to pre-condition for max performance / range / regen / comfort etc, but wouldn't mind keeping my battery cycle count low. constantly topping up a couple of percent every day seems unnecessary. same with the quick top up after the battery warming, they really need to let us make these decisions.

 

[TaxmanHog]

So does that mean that plugging in with the Ford Mobile Charger will not precondition?

It will not provide enough power to prevent the net loss on the battery, but you could precondition.

 

[TaxmanHog]

@TaxmanHog ’s experience…….

https://www.f150lightningforum.com/forum/threads/lightning-battery-heating.13082/post-277239

Was my logic/math incorrect in the attached post?

No, your numbers jive with my experiences

 

[TaxmanHog]

Well, his and my data is different. I didn't crunch the numbers. I was just posting what I've observed. I think his truck is in an unattached garage, mine is attached and stays warmer. My experience used less energy but it does show that it only used 26 of 48 available volts for the preconditioning cycle. That should be the target setting of people that want to maintain a minimum voltage setting, but also want to precondition.

I will say this, I'm glad I sprung for an Emporia energy management system for my FCSP. The data Ford gives you is very inadequate.

Yes, it's a detached garage on an exclusive service, (got my first bill yesterday for kWh accumulated from 9/30 to 11/15) and I agree the FCSP app is woefully inadequate for data geeks like us, but that's all I have to work with.

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