SunRun Require PV (Photovoltaic) system with F150 Lightning use as home back-up power

[adoublee]

From what I’ve seen so far it looks like the 240V outlet is 7.2 kW. With the 2.4 kW total from the various 120V outlets *added* to the 7.2, we get a grand total of 9.6. I’d much prefer a 240V/9.6 kW outlet as well, but it doesn’t look like that’s the plan.

Where have you seen that the 9.6kW is a split of 7.2kW to 240V outlet plus 2.4kW to 120V outlets? When I look at the spec sheet, it appears to show options of "2.4kW for all plugs" or "9.6kW" for all plugs" in the productivity section of the pages. It is true that they would have to incorporate a 50A 240V plug instead of the 30A that covers the 7.2kW of the current hybrid.

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[Nick Gerteis]

Where have you seen that the 9.6kW is a split of 7.2kW to 240V outlet plus 2.4kW to 120V outlets? When I look at the spec sheet, it appears to show options of "2.4kW for all plugs" or "9.6kW" for all plugs" in the productivity section of the pages. It is true that they would have to incorporate a 50A 240V plug instead of the 30A that covers the 7.2kW of the current hybrid.

I’ve seen the 7.2 outlet in the bed in several walk around videos of the lightning. So I just guessed that that’s the 240V outlet we’ll get; plus the 2.4 total on the standard 120V outlets would equal 9.6. Still hoping I’ll be proven wrong though!

 

[skaphan]

Yes, but note there is a 9.6kW truck AC outlet on the Platinum that is optional for most or all of the other configurations I believe. The upgrade output is 7.2kW on the hybrid so another potential benefit of the full EV.

If this is true, that brings into question why they'd go for a DC option at all. Maybe it's this: If you want to power the house, it's at least intuitively sensible to do it through the EVSE. It is also probably a good idea that there is never any question about which side (the vehicle or the home) is powering which wires on the charging cable. CCS being what it is, that leaves the DC connections to go upstream to the house, as they already use the AC pins for charging. Using a solar inverter to convert to AC makes sense in a way, because then you automatically get a transfer switch to isolate from the grid when it's down. If you just used an AC connection from the vehicle, you then have to either avoid the household circuits or make sure they are disconnected from the grid. I wonder what the protocol to tell the vehicle to power the DC connection is like? And can you use a solar array to charge the vehicle even if the grid is down, and if so what is the control logic for this?

Also, it can be beneficial to have a larger capacity that 2.4kW to start or run loads that don't run nonstop. So if your house had a 9.6kW peak load it does not mean you will run out in 16 hours. But yes, 2.4kW will do a lot for you over 0W!

Agreed!

 

[adoublee]

There seems to be a significant lack of understanding of how the back-up system will work among the Ford representatives at the various events.

That said, one that seemed to me to be the most knowledgeable at the Denver event insisted back-up will occur via the AC pins of the charge port, using the inverters of the vehicle. He insisted Lighting inverter hardware was capable of this, versus MME and Transit chargers/rectifiers that are not. He also said they were told Ford would have their own transfer switch product sku and that it is being supplied with the 80A EVSE.

All the conjecture about using the DC pins of a CCS format connector on the 80A EVSE are based on the factory photo that seemed to show a CCS connection and an external inverter on the wall. It is possible that was just an R&D setup and not the final configuration.

I'm still hoping to get something from Ford on this very soon, with order banks reportedly opening in a month. It could influence a decision between a standard range purchase + 9.6kW pro power onboard option and an extended range purchase.

Also - has Ford published anything that indicates if the 9.6kW pro power option is available in the consumer Pro model?

 

[shutterbug]

Also - has Ford published anything that indicates if the 9.6kW pro power option is available in the consumer Pro model?

Yes they have:

It is optional on PRO and XLT.

 

[bboy_72]

Yes they have:

It is optional on PRO and XLT.

Is the the 9.6kW pro power option just a set of extra plugs? Why would this be any sort of substitute for the ER battery? I am thinking that there’s some thing I don’t understand!

 

[shutterbug]

Is the the 9.6kW pro power option just a set of extra plugs? Why would this be any sort of substitute for the ER battery? I am thinking that there’s some thing I don’t understand!

It's not a substitute. You can have it with and without larger battery.

 

[adoublee]

Is the the 9.6kW pro power option just a set of extra plugs? Why would this be any sort of substitute for the ER battery? I am thinking that there’s some thing I don’t understand!

Having the truck for electric resiliency is important to me. A couple resiliency options are:

1. Get the ER and the included 80A EVSE powering home from the charger port. Benefits include longer runtime of the larger battery, potential for automatic back-up if I am out of town or the like.

2. Get the 9.6kW option which will include a 7.2kW/240VAC plug in the bed. I could wire a plug whose power is interlocked with the home's main breaker, and manually connect with a prepared cable during a power outage to get 75% power of what the ER option provides (plus additional 2.4kW from 120VAC vehicle outlets if required). Essentially this may be the lower cost way to get most of the truck's back-up power benefits, depending on what the details of the automatic back-up system actually entail.

 

[adoublee]

Yes they have:

It is optional on PRO and XLT.

Thank you! The spec sheet posted on the forum sticky post does not show options for Pro model like your clip does.

 

[shutterbug]

Thank you! The spec sheet posted on the forum sticky post does not show options for Pro model like your clip does.

Maybe the @Administrator can update the sticky

 

[pstansel]

2. Get the 9.6kW option which will include a 7.2kW/240VAC plug in the bed. I could wire a plug whose power is interlocked with the home's main breaker, and manually connect with a prepared cable during a power outage to get 75% power of what the ER option provides (plus additional 2.4kW from 120VAC vehicle outlets if required). Essentially this may be the lower cost way to get most of the truck's back-up power benefits, depending on what the details of the automatic back-up system actually entail.

Honestly this may be the route I go since I already have the external generator plug setup with breakers

 

[adoublee]

Honestly this may be the route I go since I already have the external generator plug setup with breakers

You may have to break the neutral-ground bond in the panel to make it work as well. TFL tried to power a house main panel with the hybrid and totally failed.

 

[Brian Head Yankee]

Or, the it’s option is to simply get a third party V2H unit. With a V2H device, any EV is capably of proving power V2H or V2G. These units feed power back into the house and/or grid thru the charge port.

I just spoke the to the engineers at Schneider about for medium duty trucks and school buses. It is a feature that they are all looking at. The Ford bed and frunk outlets are irrelevant. If Ford does use the power outlets, they are selling themselves short.

 

[pstansel]

You may have to break the neutral-ground bond in the panel to make it work as well. TFL tried to power a house main panel with the hybrid and totally failed.

Hrm I'll have to take a look... I assumed if it had the 240 plug that I could just use it to the same generator plug

 

[adoublee]

Or, the it’s option is to simply get a third party V2H unit. With a V2H device, any EV is capably of proving power V2H or V2G. These units feed power back into the house and/or grid thru the charge port.

I just spoke the to the engineers at Schneider about for medium duty trucks and school buses. It is a feature that they are all looking at. The Ford bed and frunk outlets are irrelevant. If Ford does use the power outlets, they are selling themselves short.

Good idea in theory but unlikely in practice for some time. I don't think Ford is committed to any V2H/V2G standard protocol - I expect the vehicle will need to handshake with their own 80A EVSE. Also, is there a UL listed V2H EVSE you are expecting to be available to purchase in the US in 2022?

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