Powertrain Malfunction/ Reduced Power

[Fastmikerx7]

I was able to have Ford roadside assistance tow the rig from the Ford Dealer in Bellevue WA to the Ford Dealer in Issaquah WA.

Why?

Because the Bellevue dealer was not meeting my expectations to say the least.
Multiple Mach E's sitting there as loaners but not offering them and kept pushing me to Ford to get $60 a day rental reimbursment.
Yea? NO!

Issaquah Dealer offered a 800 Mile Mach E GT with Performance Pack as a loaner.

I just got back in for the evening and I will say that is a VERY capable rig.

I used to be a National Level SCCA autocrosser, with MANY National level wins and the rig is VERY good. SUPRISINGLY good. Great brakes(too much front bias with the Brembo's but that is pretty much ALL new rigs) but stops HARD.
Unbridled Extended backs off the amount of acceleration but also backs off the overly safe Unbridled mode in regards to electronic nannies and I have not found the limits but I think it might be ok for what it is.
I have no doubt it would take almost any Porsche SUV on a winding road.

I kinda like the rig.

Oh! Lightning battery module #(2?) is smoked....

Sorry for the others having problems but insist on a BEV loaner or tow it to another dealer imo.

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[Phineas Magliozzi]

I'm sounding like the lucky one here. Mine has only been at the dealer for two weeks and I just got a call today saying the parts are in. Like most dealers they don't have enough qualified mechanics yet, so the Lighting that has been a the dealership (parts arrived at the same time as mine) for 6 weeks will get serviced first. I'm supposed to get mine back "mid next week". Can hardly wait.

Gotta be costing FoMoCo a fortune to deal with this...

 

[Basis0439]

This is a very scary thread to follow, as a new owner...

 

[irpete]

These dealer appointment and repair timeframes are horrendous!
Ours is now at the dealer, but in the very back of their big lot and we don't have an appointment. I'm going to pester them to diagnose the issue (should be fairly simple with OBD II and their diagnostic system, right?) because obtaining an in-warranty rental vehicle requires the diagnosis first.

@irpete : What did they do to "fix" yours? And I don't blame you for fearing more such experiences. I don't understand why Ford isn't stepping up to save their reputation ... and why the dealerships are providing such terrible service.

@YankeeCP : What is the dealership saying they are finally doing to fix yours?

And what is required to start the Ford Buyback process?

Mine was a battery module replacement under 23H01. In my case the replacement module was shipped before my appointment but the dealer didn’t touch the truck for 3 weeks and when they did they said that Ford didn’t ship the Thermal paste needed for the install. That took another 2 weeks and once it arrived the dealer waited another 3 weeks before fixing it. In total it was 8 weeks and 1 day.

 

[Lytning]

My Lightning is finally in the shop but still not fixed at 38 days and counting after delivering my truck on its appointment date ... plus waiting 5 weeks after the appointment was set up by the Ford BEV Team. Last week it took 4 attempts to balance the battery after the new module installation. The Lightning ahead of mine in the shop was delayed by a week due to battery balancing issues. Today FDRS is down and the dealer can't do any diagnostics on my truck.

I know I sound like a broken record, but every owner affected by this needs to file a NHTSA complaint. Ford is advertising 23H01 as a "customer service program", but this and other powertrain malfunctions are undoubtedly a safety issue due to sudden loss of power or potential loss of power. Following is a link to my complaint if you want to use it as a template.
https://www.nhtsa.gov/recalls?siType=C&nhtsaId=11540044

 

[RacerX98]

It has been at the dealer for evaluation for one week and they have not looked at it yet, not one single phone call. I have left messages with the service department. Seems like they don't have qualified people to assess the problem

After 2 weeks, the dealer determined that the problem is not occurring , nothing more they can do. I was told to take the truck back and drive it and see if it happens again.

 

[JetsonLightning]

@YankeeCP : Thanks for the additional information. Did Ford or the dealership at least provide you with a complimentary loaner (or rental) vehicle during those 30 days yours was in the shop?

@KurtsRPMGarage : Thanks for posting your info here as well. This seems to be the most used thread on this topic. Your situation also sounds like it fell into the CSP 23H01 category ... is that right? And same question for you on being provided a loaner vehicle?

It just so happens that a guy on the BEV Team at Ford Customer Relationship Center called me today saying that "the engineers" have looked at my FordPass error msgs and VIN and have determined that our Lightning also falls under the CSP 23H01 ("Suspect battery array"), so it looks like I'm in for the same thing. Ugh!! I hope Ford has greatly improved on their parts supply chain issues, as the dealership appt and service shop delays terrible.

For those who have gone through the Ford Buyback process, is Ford giving you enough money for your Lemon Lightning such that you feel it's fair? Or is it typically a huge financial loss?

 

[HJP]

As a point of information for those who are dealing with Ford on this issue and had to get a rental. My Lightning was in the shop for about 5 weeks. I made do for the first two week and then ended up getting a rental. Was just told that the reimbursement (about a 1000 dollars) comes in the form of prepaid mastercard with about a month or so delay between reimbursement request and when I can expect the card. So if you are racking up a big rental bill, please note that you won't get an actual check to cover your expenses (and oh the prepaid card will expire in 6 month).

 

[HJP]

@YankeeCP : Thanks for the additional information. Did Ford or the dealership at least provide you with a complimentary loaner (or rental) vehicle during those 30 days yours was in the shop?

@KurtsRPMGarage : Thanks for posting your info here as well. This seems to be the most used thread on this topic. Your situation also sounds like it fell into the CSP 23H01 category ... is that right? And same question for you on being provided a loaner vehicle?

It just so happens that a guy on the BEV Team at Ford Customer Relationship Center called me today saying that "the engineers" have looked at my FordPass error msgs and VIN and have determined that our Lightning also falls under the CSP 23H01 ("Suspect battery array"), so it looks like I'm in for the same thing. Ugh!! I hope Ford has greatly improved on their parts supply chain issues, as the dealership appt and service shop delays terrible.

For those who have gone through the Ford Buyback process, is Ford giving you enough money for your Lemon Lightning such that you feel it's fair? Or is it typically a huge financial loss?

Will let you know about the buyback. Just made the request to please be put in touch with someone to start this process. Otherwise, I will start the Georgia lemon law process. I am counting on getting essentially my purchase price refunded as that is what the lemon law here would require (vehicle was in the shop for repair at 900 miles on the odometer so the deduction for milage driven won't be much).

 

[YankeeCP]

@YankeeCP : Thanks for the additional information. Did Ford or the dealership at least provide you with a complimentary loaner (or rental) vehicle during those 30 days yours was in the shop?

@KurtsRPMGarage : Thanks for posting your info here as well. This seems to be the most used thread on this topic. Your situation also sounds like it fell into the CSP 23H01 category ... is that right? And same question for you on being provided a loaner vehicle?

It just so happens that a guy on the BEV Team at Ford Customer Relationship Center called me today saying that "the engineers" have looked at my FordPass error msgs and VIN and have determined that our Lightning also falls under the CSP 23H01 ("Suspect battery array"), so it looks like I'm in for the same thing. Ugh!! I hope Ford has greatly improved on their parts supply chain issues, as the dealership appt and service shop delays terrible.

For those who have gone through the Ford Buyback process, is Ford giving you enough money for your Lemon Lightning such that you feel it's fair? Or is it typically a huge financial loss?

The dealership did not have a loaner and set me up with a rental through Hertz. And it’s not close to a comparable truck. It’s a base model Nissan frontier. Once I had a case number through Ford this was in the email they sent me

Do you need a rental vehicle?	Your dealer can provide a rental vehicle for your personal transportation at no charge (except for fuel, insurance, and tax) while your vehicle is at the dealership for repairs. Please discuss with your dealer for guidelines and limitations.

 

[YankeeCP]

@YankeeCP : Thanks for the additional information. Did Ford or the dealership at least provide you with a complimentary loaner (or rental) vehicle during those 30 days yours was in the shop?

@KurtsRPMGarage : Thanks for posting your info here as well. This seems to be the most used thread on this topic. Your situation also sounds like it fell into the CSP 23H01 category ... is that right? And same question for you on being provided a loaner vehicle?

It just so happens that a guy on the BEV Team at Ford Customer Relationship Center called me today saying that "the engineers" have looked at my FordPass error msgs and VIN and have determined that our Lightning also falls under the CSP 23H01 ("Suspect battery array"), so it looks like I'm in for the same thing. Ugh!! I hope Ford has greatly improved on their parts supply chain issues, as the dealership appt and service shop delays terrible.

For those who have gone through the Ford Buyback process, is Ford giving you enough money for your Lemon Lightning such that you feel it's fair? Or is it typically a huge financial loss?

even if they cover a decent amount or full price it will be a financial loss given the fact I will need to get a new loan and interest rates are way higher now

 

[KurtsRPMGarage]

@YankeeCP : Thanks for the additional information. Did Ford or the dealership at least provide you with a complimentary loaner (or rental) vehicle during those 30 days yours was in the shop?

@KurtsRPMGarage : Thanks for posting your info here as well. This seems to be the most used thread on this topic. Your situation also sounds like it fell into the CSP 23H01 category ... is that right? And same question for you on being provided a loaner vehicle?

It just so happens that a guy on the BEV Team at Ford Customer Relationship Center called me today saying that "the engineers" have looked at my FordPass error msgs and VIN and have determined that our Lightning also falls under the CSP 23H01 ("Suspect battery array"), so it looks like I'm in for the same thing. Ugh!! I hope Ford has greatly improved on their parts supply chain issues, as the dealership appt and service shop delays terrible.

For those who have gone through the Ford Buyback process, is Ford giving you enough money for your Lemon Lightning such that you feel it's fair? Or is it typically a huge financial loss?

It likely is CSP 23H01 as far as I can tell. Service advisor said it was one faulty cell in one of the modules causing issues. Truck worked perfect for 12,000 miles until one morning I walked out and the dash was lit up. Built 11/2/2022.

My dealer gave me a brand new F150 xlt as a loaner luckily.

I reached out to ford on these forums and they said they would contact me. They never did but I did get a survey emailed to me from ford asking how they did. Lol.

 

[Fastmikerx7]

I watched some videos on the battery on the Lightning.

I am confident I could rebuild a module myself with some safety gear.

I am VERY happy with the design and servicibility of the pack versus alternate manu's

 

[MickeyAO]

I watched some videos on the battery on the Lightning.

I am confident I could rebuild a module myself with some safety gear.

I am VERY happy with the design and servicibility of the pack versus alternate manu's

Another post were I really wish the rolling eyes could be part of the 'like' to a post. Please explain the safety 'gear' you think you would need and your plan on both charging the module to near what the other modules are at and then the plan on balancing the strings across the module. I know it SOUNDS easy, but believe me it is hard in practice. Polarization of the strings present it's own problems in getting things balanced properly (you do know about polarization, right?)

 

[MickeyAO]

Another post were I really wish the rolling eyes could be part of the 'like' to a post. Please explain the safety 'gear' you think you would need and your plan on both charging the module to near what the other modules are at and then the plan on balancing the strings across the module. I know it SOUNDS easy, but believe me it is hard in practice. Polarization of the strings present it's own problems in getting things balanced properly (you do know about polarization, right?)

Before I just let this hang out there for the someone tries to respond...
Lets say you observe all the other strings in the battery are sitting at 3.65 V. (which should be somewhere around 50%, but remember I have not actually started testing these cells yet). And you want to add a new module to the pack.

The logical thing would be to charge the new module to 3.65 V per sting and then add it in. But what happens if you just charge it to 3.65 V per string? As soon as you take the load off the module, polarization starts and the strings will start falling below 3.65 V per string. That's no good, so you have to charge it ABOVE 3.65 V per sting. but to what voltage? Now let's say you figure out what voltage to charge it to. Will all the strings experience the same polarization to EXACTLY the same voltage? Doubtful, and in my experience, not at all. So you have to balance the strings to the exact same voltage within the module AND match the voltage to all the strings within the pack by discharging one or more strings. What is your plan on discharging a single string for this? And how much will you need to discharge with the polarization you will experience when you once again remove the load?

Just trying to balance 4 strings (as in the Tesla Li-ion 12 V battery) can be a challenge. We have had to balance a couple of different modules we have charged up for testing without the aid of a BMS and it is a long and painful process.

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