2024 DC Fast Charging Speed Limited to 120kW at EA?

[bmw325_num99]

yea that would be great. Can you upload it here or on YT? Thanks!

Alright, it will be up shortly at this link. YT is still processing the low-def version and High Def will take even longer.

195kw occurs at 1:30 mark.

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[Yellow Buddy]

Alright, it will be up shortly at this link. YT is still processing the low-def version and High Def will take even longer.

195kw occurs at 1:30 mark.

I wonder if that charger had comm issues and couldn’t determine max rate, might be why the truck shut it down.

That’s about the only explanation I can come up with. Otherwise even assuming you had a charger that could do those rates, your pack would have to be operating at a higher voltage to get those numbers.

 

[Yellow Buddy]

On the same page the previous FAQ to this one is also interesting:

How fast can the F-150 Lightning charge?

Using a 150-kilowatt (kW)+ Direct Current (DC) fast charger:

• The standard-range 98kWh battery can charge from 15-80% in about 36 minutes.*
• The extended-range 131kWh battery can charge from 15-80% in about 41 minutes.*

I believe previous MY 15-80% charge time for SR was listed as 44 minutes. This makes me wonder if Ford completely revamped the charging curve for MY24’s with lower peaks, but longer sustained high charge rates.

Time will tell - we’re still waiting for the first reported delivery of a MY24 Lightning…

I thought it might just be an updated listing. So I just went through my charge sessions and found some in the general range:

Station 1/350kW
10-80%: 42min w/176kW peak (01/2024)
13-81%: 42min w/170kW peak (01/2024)
19-81%: 49min w/163kW peak (07/2023)

Station 2/150kW
24-81%: 46min w/133kW peak (07/2023)
10-80%: 54min w/134kW peak (06/2023)

Maybe we got updates to our charge curves already. So many variables but my recent charge data seems in line with the new publishing and my older ones seem in line with the old publishing. Unfortunately it’s the one thing I don’t really monitor on my truck.

 

[jetfixr1]

Alright, it will be up shortly at this link. YT is still processing the low-def version and High Def will take even longer.

195kw occurs at 1:30 mark.

That is RIDICULOUSLY fast. I hope no damage was done to your battery, I don't think they were designed to handle that amount of power.

 

[bmw325_num99]

That is RIDICULOUSLY fast. I hope no damage was done to your battery, I don't think they were designed to handle that amount of power.

I thought the same thing! Probably took 1% battery health off of it, oh well I will use the video in my lawsuit with EA

 

[Ventorum94]

May be it is a left over from the blame game:

https://www.motortrend.com/news/ford-f-150-lightning-electrify-america-station/

It’s all about the current (amps) not the advertised power (kW)! To reach max charging rates, the dispenser has to be able to output 500A (EA 350s do, but EA 150s only output 350A). The SR and the ER will BOTH reach charging rates of 170kW (regardless of Ford marketing specs written before EA “Hyperfast” 350kW chargers even existed), but only at the 500A only available at EA 350s. At the risk of stating the obvious: it’s because the Lightning’s battery pack voltage is relatively low among EVs (low-mid 300V). 340V x 500A = 170kW
Update: my SR that reaches 170kW has the additional cooling capability of the Max Tow package. Somebody with a non-Max Tow SR truck needs to post their max charge rate, for comparison.

 

[Maxx]

It’s all about the current (amps) not the advertised power (kW)! To reach max charging rates, the dispenser has to be able to output 500A (EA 350s do, but EA 150s only output 350A). The SR and the ER will BOTH reach charging rates of 170kW (regardless of Ford marketing specs written before EA “Hyperfast” 350kW chargers even existed), but only at the 500A only available at EA 350s. At the risk of stating the obvious: it’s because the Lightning’s battery pack voltage is relatively low among EVs (low-mid 300V). 340V x 500A = 170kW
Update: my SR that reaches 170kW has the additional cooling capability of the Max Tow package. Somebody with a non-Max Tow SR truck needs to post their max charge rate, for comparison.

Logically, SR should have lower max rate than ER. Less batteries, less total current at the same pack voltage. If the max charge rates are the same, each individual battery in a SR pack is taking a higher hit of current than those in ER. I am thinking to charge only at 150s to lower my max artificially to make sure I won’t mess up my SOH prematurely. Ford didn’t seem to be too concerned about fast charging cold batteries with regen. I think they prioritize customer experience over longevity. Am I making a wrong assumption in this regard somewhere?

p.s. my Pro pack voltage is usually around 372V-374V

 

[Ventorum94]

Logically, SR should have lower max rate than ER. Less batteries, less total current at the same pack voltage. If the max charge rates are the same, each individual battery in a SR pack is taking a higher hit of current than those in ER. I am thinking to charge only at 150s to lower my max artificially to make sure I won’t mess up my SOH prematurely. Ford didn’t seem to be too concerned about fast charging cold batteries with regen. I think they prioritize customer experience over longevity. Am I making a wrong assumption in this regard somewhere?

p.s. my Pro pack voltage is usually around 372V-374V

I think it’s a great idea for you to go on parking at the old 150s, and leave the 350s for me and others who are in a hurry.

 

[Maxx]

I think it’s a great idea for you to go on parking at the old 150s, and leave the 350s for me and others who are in a hurry.

Will be happy to. I can do a lot at a charging station.

 

[LightningShow]

I’m wondering if this is the protect the batteries. If you look in the “Issues” forum, quite a few people (myself included) have had to have HVB modules replaced. They may be eliminating the “boost” charging to protect from module failure.

This is total speculation but we have had a surprising number of forum members have to get a module replaced. That’s costing Ford a pretty penny in recalls. It was smart of Ford to make the battery modular. If these instances were full battery replacements it would probably be in the automotive news pages.

ETA: I don’t fast charge very often so i doubt DCFC damaged my battery but i’m sure many people are DCFC regularly. Throttling DCFC speed is just an easy way to protect themselves and most people who aren’t EV geeks won’t even notice.

 

[LightningShow]

@tommolog can you try to get some info on Ford limiting DCFC speed to 120kW for 2024 Lightnings?

 

[Wsl346]

Somebody with a non-Max Tow SR truck needs to post their max charge rate, for comparison.

Max tow doesn't have an effect on charging speeds. No one has ever demonstrated a difference in charging between a max tow and non-max tow truck.

 

[Ventorum94]

Max tow doesn't have an effect on charging speeds. No one has ever demonstrated a difference in charging between a max tow and non-max tow truck.

Yes, I have read the same things you have, including that SR packs can’t charge at rates higher than 120kW (my SR reaches 170, and holds levels higher than 120 for a significant portion of the charge curve). However, I think those specs were probably written before 500A DCFC was commonly available. The heat resulting from charging at 500A probably results in its reduction to lower current levels as pack temperature rises. It would be interesting to know whether additional cooling capacity helps to mitigate that heat, and thereby facilitate faster charging at dispensers capable of >350amps. It’s really annoying that the facts of Ford battery charging and cooling are so veiled in mystery.

 

[tnugentfl]

With Magic Docks it is around 120kW.

Some Magicdocks are doing 500 amps now, especially the units attached to the v4 dispensers. So speed should be comparable to EA 350 kW units.

 

[davehu]

...
Some EA DC fast chargers can deliver up to 350kW of power.
Your 2024 F-150 Lightning will accept up to 120kW.
The 2023 and prior model year F-150 Lightning trucks accept up to 150kW.

just another reason I am soooo glad I got my 2023 instead of waiting for a 2024. FMC cut out a lot of things to keep the pricing low and many were not so obvious.

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