NACS adapter is now on Ford parts website (but can't be ordered yet)

[RickLightning]

Math. 56 cents per kWh. 60% charge (20 back to 80%). 131kWh battery.

.56 x 0.6 x 131 = $44.02.

25% off is $11.00. Minus $7 fee, Pass+ equals $4 profit on the first charge.

Not to mention 2% cashback credit card paying for the charge is $0.88 (twice that with Costco Visa).

Swipe charger in EA app, plug in.

Math.

I looked at Ford VISA. 2% CB card blows it away.

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[shutterbug]

Costs all boil down to what’s most important to you.

No. Cost boils down to dollars and cents, and nothing else. "cool factor" doesn't impact costs. "promoting EV charging infrastructure" doesn't impact costs. None! Those things might be important to you, but they are NOT part of cost calculation. As @RickLightning patiently attempted to explain, cost is just cost. Not any other extraneous factors. If the cost is not important to you (I assume within limits), that's fine, but don't try to pretend that paying more is somehow cheaper.

 

[Texas Dan]

No. Cost boils down to dollars and cents, and nothing else. "cool factor" doesn't impact costs. "promoting EV charging infrastructure" doesn't impact costs. None! Those things might be important to you, but they are NOT part of cost calculation. As @RickLightning patiently attempted to explain, cost is just cost. Not any other extraneous factors. If the cost is not important to you (I assume within limits), that's fine, but don't try to pretend that paying more is somehow cheaper.

Yeah, right. So you bought your Lightning because it was the most cost effective way to do the job you had planned for it and you never factored in the cool factor? Why am I finding it so hard to believe your sincerity?

 

[shutterbug]

Yeah, right. So you bought your Lightning because it was the most cost effective way to do the job you had planned for it and you never factored in the cool factor? Why am I finding it so hard to believe your sincerity?

Because you aren't paying attention. All those other factors exist. They just don't change cost calculation. You are entitled to your opinion. You just aren't entitled to your own math.

 

[Texas Dan]

I looked at Ford VISA. 2% CB card blows it away.

You obviously have NOT looked at Ford VISA Rewards card. The Ford Rewards card gives up to 10% back subject to Tier for Ford purchases and gives more rewards based on your spending habits. No other rewards card is going to give you 10% for EV charging a Ford Lightning.

 

[shutterbug]

You obviously have NOT looked at Ford VISA Rewards card. The Ford Rewards card gives up to 10% back subject to Tier for Ford purchases and gives more rewards based on your spending habits. No other rewards card is going to give you 10% for EV charging a Ford Lightning.

In what universe does 10% exceed 25% (plus membership) plus 2% (typical cashback card)?

 

[Yellow Buddy]

I take it from your response that you don’t have a Ford VISA Rewards card so you have no idea of what I’m talking about. There are a lot of different ways to look at costs. Costs all boil down to what’s most important to you.

For starters let’s look at subscription costs. EA Pass+ has a $7 per month subscription cost and now it looks like we are going need a $12 per month Tesla subscription. Do you really need to charge enough each month to offset these subscription costs?

Then there is the cool factor. How much is it worth to you just to be able to plug in and charge without hassling with multiple accounts and phone apps? At some locations with poor cell phone coverage being able to Plug&Charge is priceless.

You also have decide how much promoting EV charging infrastructure is worth to you. I started my EA Pass+ membership with rationalization that if I didn’t charge enough to offset the subscription cost I was at least providing funds monthly to EA to help them stay solvent. I’m actually taking many more long trips since I got my Lightning so I actually am giving EA a little more money without the Pass+ membership but nowhere near 25% more.

So finally we come to Ford Rewards. Of course the rewards for a single charge is not very much but if you use the rewards VISA routinely the rewards really build up. The rewards can be worth several hundred dollars a year that could be used to help pay for regular routine maintenance, new tires or even a new Lightning.

If you are a real cheapskate, do a lot of DCFC charging and are too cheap to buy a home L2 charger where you really should be doing your charging then you could save a little money with a Pass+ membership. But if you have the ability see past your next charging session then maybe you can see benefits to use FordPass to charge and paying with a Ford VISA Rewards card,

40kW. That’s the breakeven.

If you’re going to use an EA charger to get more than 40kW of juice in any single month, the Pass+ membership pays for itself.

Yes, I’m a cheapskate. No, I’m not too cheap to buy a L2 charger. I have (3) 80A home chargers, and a 14-50. I charge approximately a dozen times a month at DCFC…but that’s irrelevant.

Because the breakeven is 40kW.

So if I plug into a DCFC and need more than a 30% charge in one session. I buy the Pass+.

That aside, personally I’m sitting on 44,000 points that I can’t figure out what to use on. And I have a Ford branded tonneau, bed extender, and tow mirrors. I’d rather have the cash..

 

[Yellow Buddy]

You obviously have NOT looked at Ford VISA Rewards card. The Ford Rewards card gives up to 10% back subject to Tier for Ford purchases and gives more rewards based on your spending habits. No other rewards card is going to give you 10% for EV charging a Ford Lightning.

Are you sure you’re getting 10% back on charging?

Here’s what I see and I’m a Tier 3

They list out gas - which most cards are now associating with EV charging as well - as only 3% back. The 10% back is only on Ford service and states the breakout of which 5% of it is for Ford dealership purchase, which plug and charge is not.

I would expect the rewards to be 6 points per dollar spent with plug n charge, not 20 points per dollar spent.

3% in general is still pretty good - if you have a use for the rewards. But there are other cards (Futurecard, Sam’s club, Penfed, etc) that give equal or better cash back on top of the EA pass discount.

 

[Texas Dan]

Are you sure you’re getting 10% back on charging?

Here’s what I see and I’m a Tier 3

The 10% back is only on Ford service and states the breakout of which 5% of it is for Ford dealership purchase, which plug and charge is not.

FordPass purchases ARE charged as Ford purchases on the Ford VISA Rewards card and are eligible for the 10% rewards.

 

[queuewho]

FordPass purchases ARE charged as Ford purchases on the Ford VISA Rewards card and are eligible for the 10% rewards.

If that's the case a decent two-way road trip could help out in a future tire purchase at a Ford dealer, no?

 

[Maquis]

Math is hard……

 

[Zprime29]

Let's roll with the 10% back and do the math.

The cost in Rick's example was $44, so with 10% back you're banking $4.40 in credit or $39.60 out of pocket at the end of the day.

With Pass+, we start at $7 + $33 = $40. So we are already about even when considering the out of pocket at the end of the day. Bonus points earned from using Pass+ can also be used towards Ford purchases but have the added benefit of being available for...well everything else.

EDIT: Forgot to mention that every additional charge will have a $7 benefit for Pass+

I will say Dan has one extremely valid point on the poor cell reception and I'll extend that to activating chargers that the app says are unavailable. I've done the latter myself and it was very useful. That said, you can have plug and charge active and still get Pass+. Swipe on app first if possible to get discount. If no reception or buggy app, then use plug and charge. You give yourself the best possible way to save the most money and still provide a suitable back up when needed.

The Pass+ is not an annual subscription, it's 30 days so there is no need to compare costs for more than that time frame. Same with Tesla.

 

[hturnerfamily]

its' true: math is math, correct, but our 'feelings' about the outcome, especially when 'discounts' and 'percentages' are involved, makes it a little more cloudy, or even emotionally driven for some... 10% sounds great, on the surface, but 10% of 10cents is only a penny... 10% of $1,000 is a Hundred Dollar bill... one feels a lot better than the other...

While we all get caught up in the percentages and discounts, etc., the real outcome is the bottom-dollar cost that we REALLY pay... and that's not always integrated into the green backs, but sometimes is also our TIME and EFFORT, which sometimes has value, too...

For personal use, I don't worry so much about these 'numbers' ... convenience is the driver.

but,
if for Business use, the numbers can be a massive difference, over time... profit is the driver.

 

[Yellow Buddy]

Let's roll with the 10% back and do the math.

The cost in Rick's example was $44, so with 10% back you're banking $4.40 in credit or $39.60 out of pocket at the end of the day.

With Pass+, we start at $7 + $33 = $40. So we are already about even when considering the out of pocket at the end of the day. Bonus points earned from using Pass+ can also be used towards Ford purchases but have the added benefit of being available for...well everything else.

EDIT: Forgot to mention that every additional charge will have a $7 benefit for Pass+

I will say Dan has one extremely valid point on the poor cell reception and I'll extend that to activating chargers that the app says are unavailable. I've done the latter myself and it was very useful. That said, you can have plug and charge active and still get Pass+. Swipe on app first if possible to get discount. If no reception or buggy app, then use plug and charge. You give yourself the best possible way to save the most money and still provide a suitable back up when needed.

The Pass+ is not an annual subscription, it's 30 days so there is no need to compare costs for more than that time frame. Same with Tesla.

More math….

Let’s assume FordPass is 10% cash back, that makes the charge rate listed of $0.48/kWh to $0.43/kWh.

Let’s also assume you’re credit card with Pass+ offers 0 rewards. No cash back, no points, you’re just grateful for the convenience and opportunity to use plastic instead of paper.

The breakeven is 97kW.

So if you have a SR, a Ford credit card, and will only charge your truck once in a month via DCFC. Financially your best bet may be plug n charge…assuming you have use for the points.

Otherwise if you will charge more than 97kW in a month, it is cheaper to go with Pass+ and ANY payment form of your choice, including a Ford VISA.

If you have an ER, the breakeven is 74%.

If you charge more than 74% within a 30 day timeframe, it is more rewarding to get Pass+ and if you prefer, even pay for that with a Ford VISA.

 

[Monkey]

There are so many ways to analyze this and it depends on each person's available payment methods, among other things. I personally use our Capital One card my wife and I have had for like 25 years now. I get 3% cash back with that on automotive related purchases, so that works for Tesla charging, EA, anything Ford...

I really don't ever DCFC other than the occasional longer trip every 4~6 months. I keep the Plug N Charge active and if I'm ever out and need a charge, I'd probably just plug in and top off enough to go on my way. But for longer trips so far I've paid the Pass+ fee at the start to get the lower rate for all my charges on the trip.

I think trying to conflate the charge pricing with credit card incentives isn't helpful. Sure, the Ford card can give up to 10% but I'm not going to go get a Ford card as I don't see anything it offers me that provides enough value to have another card.

I would like to see EA/Ford work together better for pricing and so that the Pass+ membership could carry through via Plug N Charge on the Blue Oval Network.

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