Unused 30 Amp Dryer Breaker/Circuit For EV Charging

[TaxmanHog]

I have a 50 amp breaker on order, would a 60 amp be a wiser choice? The wiring will be 6 gauge on the hots and neutral, with a 10 gauge ground.

For the moment, you're planning to use the FMC with the 14-50 adapter plug, stay with the 50.

IF, you eventually plan to go to a 48 amp EVSE, that will need hard wiring and the 60 amp breaker with correctly sized wiring.


Given the very short run.............

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[StevenC56]

For the moment, you're planning to use the FMC with the 14-50 adapter plug, stay with the 50.

Looks like we posted the same conclusion simultaneously.

 

[Calvin H-C]

The proposed receptacle location inside my garage is literally back to back with my service box.

That definately makes the conduit a reasonable option.

In our case, the panel was on the other side of the wall from the garage in the basement, but about 8' further in the garage than where the EVSE was to be located.

When I got my Focus Electric almost seven years ago, I installed its EVSE on the south (right) side of the garage near the door. This was so it could reach when the car was in the garage or outside. That wall was unfinished and there's a sub panel on that side at the back that serves the garage and all outside outlets.

For the Lightning, parking in the garage is not an option, but the EVSE was to be located opposite the other on the north (left) side. The location of the main panel was ideal for this:

 

[flux capacitor]

I replace my 30 amp dryer breaker with a 40 amp breaker years ago when I bought a 32 amp EV charger from Home Depot. I replaced the 40 amp breaker with a 100 amp breaker when I installed the 80 amp charger that came with my Lightning. I only have a 150 amp main breaker but haven’t had any trouble with the circuits tripping even on hot days with the air conditioning compressors kicking on and off.

Only thing I can suggest is to try to understand your electrical system, try to figure out what loads are actually going to the electrical system at the same time and don’t assume the size of the breaker is the load. Remember there is a reason we have breakers. Tripping a breaker once in while may be a nusance but it doesn’t hurt your electrical system.

I hope you upgraded the wire size. 30a is like 10ga, 40a 8ga and for 100a is #2 AWG and you might get away with #4 AWG if less then 50ft. If all you did is replace breakers you have a fire hazard.

 

[Monkey]

I can put a 50 amp breaker in place of the 30 and run 6 gauge wiring easy enough. I'm going to disconnect the dryer wiring, tag it and move it out of the way for now. The run from the breaker location through the back of my service box to the planned location of the garage wall receptacle is only 2-3'. I'm just not sure that's the best thing to do.

One thing I didn’t see anyone address in this thread is the limitations of the Ford mobile charge cord. To put it bluntly, it’s crap. It’s occasionally flakey, many people have experienced short lifespans with it and it only charges at 30A even though it connects to a 50A breaker, which means you could use a charger that would output 240V at 40A instead.

I would recommend having an electrician look at it all, just to be sure you’re not missing something. And my installation recommendation would be to install a 60 AMP breaker, if you have enough overhead to support it, then install a good wall-mount charger like the Tesla Universal Charger or the ChargePoint Home Flex, Wallbox, Emporia, Grizzl-e, etc.. that will support a 60A circuit and charging at 48 Amps. That is your best all around solution.

Next step down would be to do the 50A breaker and circuit as you have been discussing. Direct-wire one of the above mentioned chargers. Or install a COMMERCIAL RATED 14-50 receptacle, not the $9 Leviton from Home Depot. And get yourself a good mobile charge cord that supports 40A output — *TESLA CORDED MOBILE CONNECTOR* is the same as their UMC, but hard-wired with a 14-50 connector and outputs 40A, you’ll need a NACS to J1772 adapter rated for 50A+. Or there are others out there with the J1772 connector on them. Use the Ford charge cord (rebranded Webasto unit) until you find what you’re looking for and then keep as a spare.

 

[Monkey]

The Ford charger runs at 80 amps but requires a 100 amp breaker and 3 AWG wire. I ran 70 feet and it got expensive but for few feet, the cost wouldn't be too bad.

Specifically that is the Ford Charge Station Pro and the new Charger Pro that became available a few months ago. Way to confuse things, Ford. Don’t get it confused with the Ford Pro Wall Charger which supports a 60A circuit. And if you have a 2024 or 2025 Lightning, you’re limited to charging at 48A on 240V anyway…

 

[StevenC56]

One thing I didn’t see anyone address in this thread is the limitations of the Ford mobile charge cord. To put it bluntly, it’s crap. It’s occasionally flakey, many people have experienced short lifespans with it and it only charges at 30A even though it connects to a 50A breaker, which means you could use a charger that would output 240V at 40A instead.

I would recommend having an electrician look at it all, just to be sure you’re not missing something. And my installation recommendation would be to install a 60 AMP breaker, if you have enough overhead to support it, then install a good wall-mount charger like the Tesla Universal Charger or the ChargePoint Home Flex, Wallbox, Emporia, Grizzl-e, etc.. that will support a 60A circuit and charging at 48 Amps. That is your best all around solution.

Next step down would be to do the 50A breaker and circuit as you have been discussing. Direct-wire one of the above mentioned chargers. Or install a COMMERCIAL RATED 14-50 receptacle, not the $9 Leviton from Home Depot. And get yourself a good mobile charge cord that supports 40A output — *TESLA CORDED MOBILE CONNECTOR* is the same as their UMC, but hard-wired with a 14-50 connector and outputs 40A, you’ll need a NACS to J1772 adapter rated for 50A+. Or there are others out there with the J1772 connector on them. Use the Ford charge cord (rebranded Webasto unit) until you find what you’re looking for and then keep as a spare.

I got the HD $39 Leviton receptacle at Home Depot.

 

[Monkey]

I have a 50 amp breaker on order, would a 60 amp be a wiser choice? The wiring will be 6 gauge on the hots and neutral, with a 10 gauge ground.

Edit: I should probably just stick with the 50 amp breaker from what I'm reading. 6 gauge wire on a 60 amp breaker would probably be ok for my short run, but for anything longer 4 gauge would be preferred.

6 gauge is fine (recommended) for a 60A circuit, provided it is THHN or THWN in MC or EMT (metal cladding or conduit). If you’re running 6 gauge NM-B or similar, which is normal for a 50A receptacle, then no, it’s not thermally rated for 60A charging circuit. Probably would be fine at that short run, but technically not right.

Do not install a 60A breaker if you’re going to install the 50A receptacle as you will be oversizing your circuit For your load.

 

[StevenC56]

6 gauge is fine (recommended) for a 60A circuit, provided it is THHN or THWN in MC or EMT (metal cladding or conduit). If you’re running 6 gauge NM-B or similar, which is normal for a 50A receptacle, then no, it’s not thermally rated for 60A charging circuit. Probably would be fine at that short run, but technically not right.

Do not install a 60A breaker if you’re going to install the 50A receptacle as you will be oversizing your circuit For your load.

THHN THWN 6 gauge hots and neutral, 10 gauge ground and a Leviton 1450R-BO 50 amp HD receptacle. The run from The Square D breaker to the receptacle is going to be less than 2 feet. Nothing has been installed yet, so I can change up if needed.

 

[StevenC56]

So, will there be an advantage to using a 60 amp breaker and receptacle with my 6 gauge 2-3 foot run over the 50amp parts? It's not going to cost me much more.

 

[TaxmanHog]

So, will there be an advantage to using a 60 amp breaker and receptacle with my 6 gauge 2-3 foot run over the 50amp parts? It's not going to cost me much more.

Due to the usage of the 14-50 outlet, you DO NOT want a larger breaker, even though the FMC will only draw 30 amps, it's the unknown potential risks that an overload at the plug is not protected by an excessively larger breaker.

 

[StevenC56]

Due to the usage of the 14-50 outlet, you DO NOT want a larger breaker, even though the FMC will only draw 30 amps, it's the unknown potential risks that an overload at the plug is not protected by an excessively larger breaker.

I wasn't going to change just the breaker, I would change both the receptacle and breaker to 60 amp.

 

[Tfarrell73]

EVSEs that use 60 amps charge at 48 are hardwired. No outlet

 

[TaxmanHog]

I wasn't going to change just the breaker, I would change both the receptacle and breaker to 60 amp.

That can not work with the adapters coming in your FMC kit.

Also IIRC, going above 50 amp circuit requires hard wiring by code, which isn't easy to with the stock FMC

 

[TaxmanHog]

I think we've convinced you to go the full monty and get a 48 amp hardwired EVSE for the garage and reserve the FMC for the sub-frunk when needed on long trips, great for in a pinch charging, that's what I've done with mine.

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