Selling because I drive too much.

[Maquis]

I sincerely appreciate everyone’s thoughts. This is my fourth EV since 2019, and I’ve covered about 120K all-electric miles over that time. I’m comfortable with high-mile Teslas because of their reputation, and Tesla will replace the entire pack for about $15K out of warranty.

I’m uncomfortable with the Lightning because of how the modules fail. I had a module condemned in January because the voltage was out of balance with the rest. The truck set a trouble code, limited charging, and it required a repair that would be $10K out of warranty. I fast charge frequently, but I’m not worried about degradation because it’s not a problem for modern liquid-cooled batteries, and I have no evidence to suggest the LIghtning would be different.

We have lots of evidence of modules failing because of voltage imbalances, though. I love that Ford made a serviceable pack, but there’s no world where I can lower an 1,800-lb pack to replace a module. Two years from now, I’ll still be paying down the loan, and a sudden high-dollar module failure would be crushing.

Maybe this is unfounded. Perhaps these modules die young or not at all, and 200,000-mile Lightnings will be common a decade from now. But what if they’re not? My previous 3 EVs never had a battery problem…only this Lightning. I love the truck, and things would be different if I was living my 2018 lifestyle. I was still active duty back then and drove a reasonable of miles.

Good points about the fuel cost difference, but half my miles are on the road. I made my last trip in my 20-year-old Expedition, and my fuel cost at 10.7 MPG over 3,200 miles was almost identical to my Lightning. Charging at home might as well be free, but public charging ain’t cheap!





You’ve got a great eye!

Yup, I was there last month and it was one of the most amazing places I’ve seen. I’ll probably make it out there again next spring.

Your concern is understandable. If worrying about it is going to keep you up at night, it’s not worth it. Best of luck with your replacement.

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[Scorpio3d]

Just thinking out loud! I totally get where you’re coming from and it is definitely a difficult decision to try to make especially with the financial considerations. If you were driving an ICE vehicle and it had a “similar“ type repair not sure what that would be fuel pump or something with the head or valves, engine issue, etc. would you be feeling the same? I know this is not entirely the same because this is a newer technology…
How many miles were on it when you had the module failure and how many have you put on since?
Not trying to change your mind or complicate your thought process. I just always would want to completely think things through from all angles before making that kind of decision.
I wish you the best of luck with whatever you decide to do!

 

[MrLoganRoss]

Mine is at 98% with lots of DCFC, but that’s not what bothers me. I don’t think the battery health is gonna come anywhere close to 80%, even at 200K.

My battery health was also at 98% when I had a module fail, and it limped to the shop at the same 98%. I’m worried about cell/module failure out of warranty, not battery degradation. This may not be a problem out of warranty…maybe they die young or not at all?

I’d be in a financial pickle if I had an out-of-warranty failure on the road while I was still paying it off. I’ve got enough to stress about without that on my mind…I’d probably feel different if I didn’t already have a module replaced.

Would an extended warranty be an option?

 

[TomB985]

Just thinking out loud! I totally get where you’re coming from and it is definitely a difficult decision to try to make especially with the financial considerations. If you were driving an ICE vehicle and it had a “similar“ type repair not sure what that would be fuel pump or something with the head or valves, engine issue, etc. would you be feeling the same? I know this is not entirely the same because this is a newer technology…
How many miles were on it when you had the module failure and how many have you put on since?
Not trying to change your mind or complicate your thought process. I just always would want to completely think things through from all angles before making that kind of decision.
I wish you the best of luck with whatever you decide to do!

That’s a good point, and much of that is driving my decision process.

I’ve lost more to depreciation over the last ten years than anything else. I also have two older cars, an ‘04 Expedition and a ‘13 Prius. Neither are worth very much, but I’ve kept them around because they’ve been good to me.

My leading option is to sell the truck and drive the Prius around town, using the Expedition to pull and travel with. Use those until something blows up, then get something newer with a focus on total cost of ownership. I can afford something new, but don’t want to be in a situation where I’m underwater for the entire life of the loan.

Maybe I should stick to something cheaper because of how many miles I drive. Everything eventually depreciates to nothing, and I’m wearing them out quick at this pace. The only thing I’m certain about is how much of a beating I’ve taken on this Lightning. The rate of loss is slower now, but I’d owe over $25K by the time I run out of warranty. That’s not a situation I want to be in.

Hell…with the deals offered on new ones, I’d come out ahead if I sold today, drove my beater until the spring, then bought a new one with the silly discounts we’re seeing. Some have posted $25K off a new flash?! That’s nuts! Carvana is offering me $35K for it…there’s no way I’d buy this truck for $35K with new trucks being discounted that much.

 

[Maineiac12]

I saw this same post on Facebook earlier today. Enjoy retirement!

(and yes, those Flash deals are real)

 

[Zaptor]

Well, at least Atlas Blue should be an easy private sale (don't let the dealer give you a measly $35k for it!)

Good luck and happy trails

Cheers
Zap

 

[Mach Turtle]

It's a race!

Will replacement battery prices come down, and reliable chargers become more common, before your battery slowly degrades enough to cause a problem? Place your bets now...well, that's what we're all doing.

Hope you win the bet, whichever option you choose.

 

[Maquis]

Would an extended warranty be an option?

Extended warranties covering the battery are not available from what I’ve seen.

 

[MrLoganRoss]

Extended warranties covering the battery are not available from what I’ve seen.

I guess my question is whether a $15,000 “repair“ is that big of a deal after 200,000 miles. I know that ice vehicles require engine and transmission and all sorts of repairs after that amount of use.

 

[Newton]

I completely understand, Ford does not have the history with EVs that Tesla and Nissan do so there is a lot that we don’t know about this particular vehicle. Battery manufacturing techniques differ as well as quality control.

I would say that if you anticipate getting to 100K a year from now then it might make financial sense to sell the truck anyway if you are not planning a long term relationship with it, since any car loses a lot of value when it goes out of warranty. I was interested in an Audi E-Tron for awhile and it was amazing how quickly they dropped in value once they got out of warranty, and how they woud stop selling. If they are aging out of warranty the dealers can put on a CPO warranty but I don’t think they can do it if the mileage is too high.

 

[Heliian]

Best of luck, hope you find a vehicle that suits your needs.

Your fears are unfounded, no one vehicle is more reliable than another, they all break eventually.

 

[TomB985]

Best of luck, hope you find a vehicle that suits your needs.

Your fears are unfounded, no one vehicle is more reliable than another, they all break eventually.

There’s a ton of data about reliability between models and brands, and they’re not all equal. I hope you’re right about the Lightning, though!

But unless you or someone else is writing the check if you’re wrong, I’m not comfortable with the risk in less than two years. I can still manage most repairs by palming the ratchet and using power tools, but I can’t lower an 1,800-lb battery.

 

[Heliian]

There’s a ton of data

Yup, theres a ton of data, but that still doesn't translate to you having a reliable vehicle, you could always end up a statistical outlier.

You wouldn't change your own transmission when it blows up either.

 

[subseavet]

I was forced into retirement a few years ago because of a severe hand disability, and I’ve found a sense of happiness by being somewhere else. Anywhere else. I drove 40,000 miles last year, and I’m not slowing down unless/until my hands force me to. This truck has taken me from Minnesota to both coasts and down to south Texas, and it’s been nearly flawless except for a module failure last January. It has 47,000 miles on it, and I’d be over 100K in less than two years. I can’t pay it off that fast, and I’d be one of the first to push past the 100K battery warranty.

I’d keep it if they had a demonstrated history of holding up past the warranty period, but that won’t exist for awhile. I expect it’ll be radiactive on the used market once the warranty expires, so I think I’m best selling now and finding something I can confidently put 200K on.

This is my fourth EV and I hate to go back to gas, but I’ve gotta get my priorities in order. Being somewhere else tomorrow is more important than driving a nice electric pickup. I know this forum isn’t an airport, and I don’t need to announce my departure, but I thought this was worth thinking about for others who drive lots of miles.

I'm a power engineer and have done a lot of work with a lot of batteries over the years. All kinds of weird ones for undersea vehicles, etc. I understand your fears, but given how many miles you've made it with your current battery and the fact that battery costs will be going down over time, I would not rush to trade or ditch your Lightning. From your pics, it looks like it's bringing you a lot of joy and great days on amazing adventures (I hope to have more pics like yours!) As another person already said, batteries don't just die. With the mileage you've already got, if you had bad cells or a fully bad module, you'd already know. Chances are you've got a decent battery. And I will speak from experience and say that no two batteries of the same chemistry from the same manufacturer are ever alike! We are still not there on manufacturing and quality repeatability but we are making great strides and we have fewer did batteries out of the gate. As long as you're taking good care of your battery, there is no reason it won't last you well beyond 100K miles. Try to avoid a lot of fast charging. Charge only to 80-85% most days. Periodically charge to 100%. Keep an eye on your coolant and maintain that very important system. And maintain your 12V system. You're on a great path towards happy long term ownership and the cost to sell and replace your lighting with a comparable ICE vehicle will almost certainly have you on the losing end of that deal monetarily. Even if you have to replace a module or the whole battery down the road, I would suggest the cost to do so if/when that day comes will likely be less or on par than the cost to switch to ICE, etc. With all of this, I have to caveat that anything could happen, but bad batteries typically show themselves pretty fast unless something causes them to go bad later in life (cell over temp, cell over voltage, cell physical damage due to an accident, etc.) Do what makes sense for you, but don't feel like you HAVE to go. You don't. You likely have many happy miles ahead. Whatever you choose to do, be well and stay happy and healthy! Thanks for sharing your story and photos.

 

[thunderbayterry]

I was forced into retirement a few years ago because of a severe hand disability, and I’ve found a sense of happiness by being somewhere else. Anywhere else. I drove 40,000 miles last year, and I’m not slowing down unless/until my hands force me to. This truck has taken me from Minnesota to both coasts and down to south Texas, and it’s been nearly flawless except for a module failure last January. It has 47,000 miles on it, and I’d be over 100K in less than two years. I can’t pay it off that fast, and I’d be one of the first to push past the 100K battery warranty.

I’d keep it if they had a demonstrated history of holding up past the warranty period, but that won’t exist for awhile. I expect it’ll be radiactive on the used market once the warranty expires, so I think I’m best selling now and finding something I can confidently put 200K on.

This is my fourth EV and I hate to go back to gas, but I’ve gotta get my priorities in order. Being somewhere else tomorrow is more important than driving a nice electric pickup. I know this forum isn’t an airport, and I don’t need to announce my departure, but I thought this was worth thinking about for others who drive lots of miles.

Hi There Tom! I wish you all the best! I am like you a little bit, I yearn for the open road . . . . . I've only owned my EV for just over a year, but I drove 1,000's of road-trip miles on my previous ICE trucks . . . . soon I'm going to start road-tripping with my Lightning (I'm thinking my first road trip will be Thunder Bay, ON to Las Vegas for CES in January).

Anyhow, I'm wondering - I noticed that you have towed camper trailers - that teardrop one and the other one. I note you have an extended range Lightning (as do I) In the real world, what kind of range are you getting pulling those light camper trailers on the HWY? And how fast are you generally driving when pulling those?

Cheers and all the best to you!

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