Anyone getting Concerned that Ford is not in on EV for the long haul

[Scorpio3d]

I own a 2013 Chevy Volt that car is still running strong. This little truck should do the same.
Only wish it had 120 mile electric range 62 is not enough.

All Ford has to do is put a larger battery and make the Maverick a plug-in hybrid and they will have the same vehicle!

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[Scorpio3d]

We are really decades away from technology being there for true replacement in 99% of the use cases.

The sad reality is we need to stop thinking complete replacement at the moment. There is a very good reason Oregons 2035 car plan is EV and PHEV centric. The Ram Charger if it comes to light will be what we can expect for people that need that long range distance hauling, but can still be efficient and “operational” environmental friendly.

For true EV acceptance, I think we need a car with a 20-80% highway speed usable range of 200-240 miles and 150 kw chargers or better no more than 50 miles apart on every state and federal highway.

The desire and need to cram miles into the battery based on size can’t win the race and a robust charger network along the highway system will ease people’s minds and slowly break the “I need 600 miles of range” mentality.

Like this weekend I took my Lightning camping 120 miles a way. Needed to get something at WallyWorld and was like “well we might need to charge on the way home so let’s charge” and got 46kW in 20 minutes that gave me back most of the mileage I used to get there, and didn’t spend a second waiting to charge.

I would disagree that we do not need longer than 200 to 240 mile at highway speeds…… sort of.
We need batteries or electrical architecture that will allow us to fully refill our EV’s as quickly as we could fill up a gas tank!

Someday in the future(Hopefully in my lifetime) They will figure out solid state batteries, and you will have super long range and quick recharging times.

It will just be nice to be able to get on the road and stop when you want to not necessarily when you have to recharge.

 

[Grease Lightning]

I would disagree that we do not need longer than 200 to 240 mile at highway speeds…… sort of.

It always sounds good to claim great range but 240 miles of highway speed is three hours of driving, safety statistics show that to stay alert behind the wheel you should stop for 15 minutes every two hours.

So it does not seem unreasonable to extend that concept to 2-3 hours for a break and have a lightning sized battery charge say 200 miles in around 30 minutes.

So if T3 can improve efficiency so at 70 you can average 2.2 mi/kw we are looking at only needing to increase the average charging speed over the 10-80% curve to north of 200kW/h which is totally achievable with today’s technology.

Way more productive to focus on improvements that are achievable today or tomorrow rather then fantasizing about unicorns and pixie dust.

 

[Scorpio3d]

It always sounds good to claim great range but 240 miles of highway speed is three hours of driving, safety statistics show that to stay alert behind the wheel you should stop for 15 minutes every two hours.

So it does not seem unreasonable to extend that concept to 2-3 hours for a break and have a lightning sized battery charge say 200 miles in around 30 minutes.

So if T3 can improve efficiency so at 70 you can average 2.2 mi/kw we are looking at only needing to increase the average charging speed over the 10-80% curve to north of 200kW/h which is totally achievable with today’s technology.

Way more productive to focus on improvements that are achievable today or tomorrow rather then fantasizing about unicorns and pixie dust.

I think we are generally on the same page. I generally stop within that timeframe as I want a bathroom break and maybe get a snack, walk around for a minute, etc. So if my truck would charge or fill up in that 10 to 15 minute timeframe, no problem at all, but when it is 30 minutes plus….

I do not know what the speed limits are in your neck of the woods, but in Texas you will get run over if you’re doing 70 miles an hour. Generally the speed limits on the highways are 75+ and even if you are driving 75 you better not be in the fast lane.

Technology is improving at a rapid pace. If you look at what the technology was when Ford first started developing the lightning 4 or 5 maybe 6 years ago and what it is today and what it will be in a couple years when the new generation of EV’s comes out there will be substantial improvements and in another four or five or six years….. I don’t think that is unicorns and pixie dust.

The smart phone was introduced in around 2007 which is not that long ago and it was nothing compared to what we have today. I mean I am literally talking to my phone and it is converting it to text on the screen so I can send it out to the universe.-how cool is that?!! Not that many years ago that was considered unthinkable.

 

[FloridaMan655321]

It always sounds good to claim great range but 240 miles of highway speed is three hours of driving, safety statistics show that to stay alert behind the wheel you should stop for 15 minutes every two hours.

I had a 2003 Jetta TDI, manual, and that would get well over 400 miles on the highway. I made multiple 2800 mile trips with it and I had to stop before I was empty just to use the bathroom lol.
It was hella nice though in that every other stop I could just hit up a rest area and not have to stop at a gas station. It would be really nice if rest areas had electric hookups.

 

[Rickpo4238]

Hello to everyone in the forum

I am a bit of a junky for EV news, developments and new Tech. It will not come to anyones surprise that there has been a bit of a push back with the transition to EV. Loads of mis-information by people that have no clue about what they are talking about. Most probably either don't own one or bought one with the wrong spec or application. IE they haul heavy and travel long distances the majority of the time.

Any rate I will get to the point now, driving an EV is pretty much driving a computer that gets you from A to B efficiently. The fact it is a computer and by changing software, things can become more efficient and useable. Tesla has demonstrated just how much they can improve on older models efficiency by changing the software that runs the car. They can even add new features with an upload. Long term longevity with Tesla is not in question.

This brings me to FORD, Ford has made some rather large retreats in this segment of the market. They have either dropped future projects or delayed them by years. So looking at FORD now as a future EV company, I am having doubts. I lease 2 vehicles from FORD, MachE and Lightning. The MachE will go back at the end of the lease ( I figure I will be able to buy a new car for the price of the residual). With the Lightning, I was planning to keep it for it utility nature of the car and since it is electric, it will have a long life left in 4 yrs. Here's my challenge, I was going to buy it out after the first month of the lease and save the interest and call it a day.
Now with all the moves Ford is making in a negative way, I am not sure that they will either be around to service the vehicle or keep the software improvements happening. Software with Ford is not their best quality. This is not by any means a FORD bash, heck I leased 2 of them.

Any thoughts or insights??

Did I make the wrong decision and jump onto the wrong horse??

Cheers!

I’m not worried. The appetite for electric vehicles is not accelerating as fast as it initially did as early adopters have already moved to electric vehicles. As a veteran of the technology industry, I am fully aware that it took 26 years for mobile phones to become ubiquitous and for my 80 year-old father to tell me I have to have a mobile phone. Software sales are the same. 30% adopters in the first four months of software release and the remaining 70% buying in over three years. It will come.

 

[Crullbri]

Just a quick point. I would ride your lease out and turn it in at the end. I feel technology is advancing quickly and battery efficiency will continue to get better. Quicker charge times and longer ranges. I read where there is a test battery that can go from 20% to 80% in 10 min. That is as fast as filling up with fuel. Just my thought. I worry when new tech comes out, am i going to be stuck with an outdated Lightning? I bought mine, have never leased, Just me.

 

[Hank42]

I think FORD did right by not pursuing the BEV Expedition. Could they have done it? Sure - look at the F150 Lightning - excellent job there - and they used it as a platform to collect valuable data for the T3.

If they electrified the Expedition the same way they did the F150, it would be underwhelming and they would have to support that platform, at a loss, for many many years. Better to take that loss on their F150 mule and create a new optimized platform for an ground up efficient Expedition based on the new platform.

And for all the "FORD loses $xxx on each F-150" I see that as R&D costs - however bean-counters might allocate the spend.

 

[hoovertac]

I saw Jim Farleys interview about EVs about a month ago & even though it was encouraging, Fords easing back on their plans for EV’s makes me nervous in regards to maintenance & support for my MME. EV adoption is still happening but at a slower pace & maybe even slower depending on the next election. Is this adjustment necessary? American car makers need to stay in the game or risk seriously falling behind.

 

[lipnorth]

We are in a weird spot where the infrastructure is getting there but not quite yet. I love driving mine around town and charging at home but scared to take trips. I've test a few EA stations here and there and half of the time I get charging errors. I would hate to get stranded 90 miles from home.

I'm on the East Coast and made a dozen long-distance trips this summer in the lightning and had no trouble staying charged. electrify America was there every step of the way, some of the hotels had free charging available and in other places I was able to find slower chargers overnight nearby. I stayed in major metropolitan areas and rural areas like the Catskill mountains.

When I first bought the car, I had major range anxiety but that is virtually vanished.

 

[mgmessner89]

I'm on the East Coast and made a dozen long-distance trips this summer in the lightning and had no trouble staying charged. electrify America was there every step of the way, some of the hotels had free charging available and in other places I was able to find slower chargers overnight nearby. I stayed in major metropolitan areas and rural areas like the Catskill mountains.

When I first bought the car, I had major range anxiety but that is virtually vanished.

I had my first major oh crap moment this weekend. I had a trip planned from Phoenix to Show AZ, about 200 miles but huge elevation change. There’s a EA station in Payson half way between

I check the app before I leave and says the station has 4/4 chargers available. Hour and half later and guess what, the chargers are all down and apparently have been for a day or two. This is the only charger within 80 miles. I theoretically had enough range to make it but much more elevation climb. I had a choice to turn around and go home or risk it. Well I risked it and drove about 50 mph and barely made it with range.

i know this is an anecdote but I hated this. This was the only charger on a major highway in AZ for about 180 miles and large elevation climb. About 1100 to 6700

 

[Frankhpns]

Hello to everyone in the forum

I am a bit of a junky for EV news, developments and new Tech. It will not come to anyones surprise that there has been a bit of a push back with the transition to EV. Loads of mis-information by people that have no clue about what they are talking about. Most probably either don't own one or bought one with the wrong spec or application. IE they haul heavy and travel long distances the majority of the time.

Any rate I will get to the point now, driving an EV is pretty much driving a computer that gets you from A to B efficiently. The fact it is a computer and by changing software, things can become more efficient and useable. Tesla has demonstrated just how much they can improve on older models efficiency by changing the software that runs the car. They can even add new features with an upload. Long term longevity with Tesla is not in question.

This brings me to FORD, Ford has made some rather large retreats in this segment of the market. They have either dropped future projects or delayed them by years. So looking at FORD now as a future EV company, I am having doubts. I lease 2 vehicles from FORD, MachE and Lightning. The MachE will go back at the end of the lease ( I figure I will be able to buy a new car for the price of the residual). With the Lightning, I was planning to keep it for it utility nature of the car and since it is electric, it will have a long life left in 4 yrs. Here's my challenge, I was going to buy it out after the first month of the lease and save the interest and call it a day.
Now with all the moves Ford is making in a negative way, I am not sure that they will either be around to service the vehicle or keep the software improvements happening. Software with Ford is not their best quality. This is not by any means a FORD bash, heck I leased 2 of them.

Any thoughts or insights??

Did I make the wrong decision and jump onto the wrong horse??

Cheers!

I think it will depend on the election. I am a Republican but love my Lightning.

 

[lipnorth]

I had my first major oh crap moment this weekend. I had a trip planned from Phoenix to Show AZ, about 200 miles but huge elevation change. There’s a EA station in Payson half way between

I check the app before I leave and says the station has 4/4 chargers available. Hour and half later and guess what, the chargers are all down and apparently have been for a day or two. This is the only charger within 80 miles. I theoretically had enough range to make it but much more elevation climb. I had a choice to turn around and go home or risk it. Well I risked it and drove about 50 mph and barely made it with range.

i know this is an anecdote but I hated this. This was the only charger on a major highway in AZ for about 180 miles and large elevation climb. About 1100 to 6700

Yikes that does suck and is an issue with public charging. I have encountered chargers that were down upon arrival, not fun. Hopefully I'll get my Tesla adaptor someday soon and then a host of additional chargers will become available.

Did you have a Tesla adaptor? Were there Tesla stations that could have helped? If you dont have your adaptor yet there are ones you can buy online which would open up the Tesla stations.

 

[mgmessner89]

Yikes that does suck and is an issue with public charging. I have encountered chargers that were down upon arrival, not fun. Hopefully I'll get my Tesla adaptor someday soon and then a host of additional chargers will become available.

Did you have a Tesla adaptor? Were there Tesla stations that could have helped? If you dont have your adaptor yet there are ones you can buy online which would open up the Tesla stations.

I do have the Tesla adapter but the chargers in Payson are not compatible. Hopefully they change that because Payson is a huge middle spot for a lot of camping/vacation places in AZ. It’s either Payson or bust at this point.

I do camp up this way a bit so I hope this was a fluke more than anything because everything about the EV experience has been great

 

[lipnorth]

I do have the Tesla adapter but the chargers in Payson are not compatible. Hopefully they change that because Payson is a huge middle spot for a lot of camping/vacation places in AZ. It’s either Payson or bust at this point.

I do camp up this way a bit so I hope this was a fluke more than anything because everything about the EV experience has been great

Hope they open up for you, I did see that around me only some of the stations are available.

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