Come backs when people tout the CT as being magically way better than your Lightning

[CRAIGC540]

My first look at the CT I was like that thing is ugly, it looks like they should drop it off on the moon so when man gets back to moon he will have a moon rover to ride in. Now over time, seeing it wrapped and some angles looking good to me plus all the tech I am now wanting a CT. I have always been a gadget man so tech first looks second..
I will accept delivery of a non foundation all wheel drive CT when my # is called.

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[Effonefiddy Lightning]

You guys should watch Top Gears podcast with Jason Cammisa on the cybertruck and also Jason cammisas review of the cybertruck. It may not be for you in particular but if you still don't get it at this point, you're just throwing punches in the air.
To the original poster of this thread, all of the negatives you stated about the cybertruck, the cybertruck fans don't care that your F150 may be better. I don't understand why you people don't get it. You all are just preaching to the choir of people who don't care about the cybertruck anyway. So who are you trying to convince that you're truck is better.
FYI, I own a Lightning, so don't think i'm some tesla fan boy, but I understand the appeal of the cybertruck. Throwing jabs at Elon Musk or Tesla does nothing to make your truck better than the cybertruck. It's quite childish and pointless.
Also having driven this lightning for 3 months now. I can tell you there are plenty of negatives to go around with this truck compared to a Tesla. But I do like my truck.

 

[Effonefiddy Lightning]

CT owners are most likely hard-core Tesla fanboys so it'll be a tough sell...

But, I'm curious though what a thing like that (CT) would cost to insure.

Why would you care? You're not buying one.

I say:
I hope you like it when you get it as much as I like the Lightning, I have had it for a year already.
(the year isn't entirely true...)

And if they do why does it matter to you?

 

[mr.Magoo]

Why would you care? You're not buying one.

Why would you care? You're not interested in the answer.

The less d-ck'ish answer would be: my reason is in my original statement: I'm curious.

If everyone just stayed within the roams of what they need and didn't learn new things, explore and stay curious we'd still be stuck in the stone age. Then again, we wouldn't have to deal with keyboard warriors so perhaps it wouldn't be so bad.

 

[RickKeen]

To the original poster of this thread, all of the negatives you stated about the cybertruck, the cybertruck fans don't care that your F150 may be better.

Right now the Cybertruck is the shiny new thing. I have watched all the videos, dug through all the specs, and understand the engineering. Its a great product.

But its not magic.

I was one of the first to put down a CT reservation. Was stoked to get a 3/4-ton capability EV truck for $50k.
Meanwhile, I bought the Ford to kind of hold me over. Now, after driving it for a year, the Ford is better than I thought it would be.
And wading through all the hype and comparing to what Tesla is actually selling at the $80k (and currently $100k) price, its more of a toss up than one would presume from Tesla's EV market leadership.

 

[Randall Stephens]

I think a lot of the excitement for the cyber truck has been focused on what’s inside, a 48v system, air suspension, steer by wire, etc etc. the tech heavy (read usually younger) crowd fawn over this stuff. What I haven’t seen are reviews showing why any of these things make the car better. Joe Sixpack doesn’t care how many volts the hvb is what the lvb voltage is either. What he does care about is why he had to climb into the bed to get something because he can’t reach over the side, or why he can’t use the bed if he wants a spare tire, or why he’s replacing air bags in the suspension before he’s finished paying off his 84 month loan.

is there tech here? Absolutely. Do other companies have tech in their trucks? Yep. Do those companies talk about their tech or do they show you all the things their vehicles can do with that tech? They show you, and to me, by not showing any truck type stuff from their hand picked influencer review crowd, they’ve admitted that a truck audience isn’t who the cyber is for, it’s for car people.

 

[Effonefiddy Lightning]

Right now the Cybertruck is the shiny new thing. I have watched all the videos, dug through all the specs, and understand the engineering. Its a great product.

But its not magic.

I was one of the first to put down a CT reservation. Was stoked to get a 3/4-ton capability EV truck for $50k.
Meanwhile, I bought the Ford to kind of hold me over. Now, after driving it for a year, the Ford is better than I thought it would be.
And wading through all the hype and comparing to what Tesla is actually selling at the $80k (and currently $100k) price, its more of a toss up than one would presume from Tesla's EV market leadership.

When I put my deposit in for a Lightning 2 years ago I thought I was going to buy a truck for 40k instead I got one for 30k more, and app that truly sucks, and slow software. Tesla is not alone with broken promises.
Love my truck though, but they need better software engineers.

 

[Effonefiddy Lightning]

Why would you care? You're not interested in the answer.

The less d-ck'ish answer would be: my reason is in my original statement: I'm curious.

If everyone just stayed within the roams of what they need and didn't learn new things, explore and stay curious we'd still be stuck in the stone age. Then again, we wouldn't have to deal with keyboard warriors so perhaps it wouldn't be so bad.

It seems everyone is on the bash tesla band wagon. "My truck is better than thou". It was a rhetorical question.

 

[lightspeed]

Compared to the Cybertruck AWD, the Ford Lightning ER is:
Faster
Lighter
Cheaper
Actually available 18 months ago.
Larger battery
Faster charging curve 20-80%
Larger interior.
Larger total cargo volume.
Bad volume is within a couple of cubic feet.
What is a Cybertruck driver going to put in those last cubic feet up near the window? Won't it jam the cover from retracting?
Is available with dozens of types of bed covers - more versatile.
Has thousands of 3rd party manufactures who make compatible accessories including things like recovery winches, snow plows, in-bed storage systems, toolboxes, bike racks, kyak racks, motorcycle chocks, gun racks and gun safes,
Comes in 12 factory colors, 9 for no added charge. None cost $6500.
Also has electric rack and pinion steering.
Comes with a spare tire standard.
Does not show fingerprints.
You can actually see out the back. Good luck backing the CT in the rain.
Available towing mirrors.
Available sliding rear window
Available opening sun roof.
Available safe.
Availalble tailgate step

Towing is 11,000 vs 10,000. What do you actually tow at 11k with a 1/2 ton class EV, bro?

Rear steering -Turn Radius is only like 4 ft smaller on a truck that is already shorter. Seems like Tesla is making up for some bad engineering on the front with more cost/weight/failure points in the back. Maybe just learn how to park a truck?

Stainless steel - Tesla wasted all the weight savings from their giga castings and structural battery pack to make the truck bullet proof. Seems like a gimmick. Maybe consider finding a new place to live if you need a bullet proof truck? Steel slab sides is like battleship technology. Ford's "innovative" aluminum skin actually saves weight.


Even the F150L Pro version is just as fast as the CT AWD and only costs $49k.

I was excited about the CT for two reasons: 500+ mile range and a rumored 1000v battery and up to 500kW+ charge rate for $79K. What they released instead was a tech-nerd showcase with 250 mile range. So now looking forward to RAM REV and GM truck if they can figure out how to produce it at a better price.

 

[RickLightning]

Just ask them to show you their spare tire.

I hope this wouldn't be your response. #Weaksauce

Many vehicles come without spares, like the Mach-E.

 

[Txxthie]

I think a lot of the excitement for the cyber truck has been focused on what’s inside, a 48v system, air suspension, steer by wire, etc etc. the tech heavy (read usually younger) crowd fawn over this stuff. What I haven’t seen are reviews showing why any of these things make the car better. Joe Sixpack doesn’t care how many volts the hvb is what the lvb voltage is either. What he does care about is why he had to climb into the bed to get something because he can’t reach over the side, or why he can’t use the bed if he wants a spare tire, or why he’s replacing air bags in the suspension before he’s finished paying off his 84 month loan.

is there tech here? Absolutely. Do other companies have tech in their trucks? Yep. Do those companies talk about their tech or do they show you all the things their vehicles can do with that tech? They show you, and to me, by not showing any truck type stuff from their hand picked influencer review crowd, they’ve admitted that a truck audience isn’t who the cyber is for, it’s for car people.

The CT is for anyone who wants it. The Lightning was my first truck because it was an EV. Ford disclosed previously that many Lightning buyers were 1st time truck buyers and also new to the brand. You can argue that “real truck owners” don’t buy electric pickups, at least yet! A Super Duty is far more capable at doing truck stuff.
Good technology is easy to use and mostly unknown to the average user. Tesla is attracting buyers from all brands, demographics and age groups.

 

[Txxthie]

Love my truck though, but they need better software engineers.

They need to produce a software defined vehicle to be economically competitive vs Tesla. The battery is too expensive to allow for scale, so costs must be reduced in other areas. All legacy manufacturers are losing money producing BEVs. The Lightning platform is not sustainable at current price levels, which forced Ford to cut 2024 production in 1/2.

Tesla has been producing software defined vehicles since the Model S introduction in 2012. As far as technology goes, Tesla is playing a different game. It seems like the OEMs can compete, but when you really understand what’s required, it’s doubtful. The model Y introduced in 2020 is now the best selling vehicle in the world. Much of the DNA and more is found in the CT. The truck landscape might look a lot different in 5 years.
An excellent recent discussion on software defined vehicles is found here::

 

[RickKeen]

They need to produce a software defined vehicle to be economically competitive vs Tesla. The battery is too expensive to allow for scale, so costs must be reduced in other areas. All legacy manufacturers are losing money producing BEVs. The Lightning platform is not sustainable at current price levels, which forced Ford to cut 2024 production in 1/2.

Tesla has been producing software defined vehicles since the Model S introduction in 2012. As far as technology goes, Tesla is playing a different game. It seems like the OEMs can compete, but when you really understand what’s required, it’s doubtful. The model Y introduced in 2020 is now the best selling vehicle in the world. Much of the DNA and more is found in the CT. The truck landscape might look a lot different in 5 years.
An excellent recent discussion on software defined vehicles is found here::

Not sure I follow on the "software-defined vehicle" lowering cost.
The software is much more of an added functionality and value. A lot of what Tesla enthusiasts talk about being valuable in their cars are all the software features.
But software is hella expensive to make the first copy. You need to divide that cost with volume (ala Microsoft or Apple). Until the other manufacturers go all-in on software being part of the product they are selling and become more vertically integrated as also being software companies, they are not going to be able to compete on the software.

In regards to the remainder of the vehicle, I would posit that traditional car mfg. can certainly compete. They know how to source or build mechanical things. And they know how to scale. A decade ago, they were a lot better at it than Tesla was. Now, they are probably still on par. Sure, Tesla is pushing some innovations. But mostly they are just stubbornly including expensive and heavy things like a bullet proof skin that the market will eventually decide they are not so interested in paying for. Jury probably still out on 4-wheel steer.

Tesla's other two advantages have nothing to do with the vehicle. The exclusive Tesla charging network at this point is an anti-competitive tying arrangement. Yes, they are saying they will open it up, but they are still keeping some differentiated pricing, and have wriggled out of retrofitting the bulk of the network (V2 chargers).

The other issue for other car companies is Tesla's direct sales model. Traditional car dealers don't care short term if a new Ford or GM electric vehicle succeeds. Its just a hassle for them, actually. More models to stock. More to learn about. More training for their service techs. They already have ICE products that sell well (for now). And climbing the hill of selling an EV from 2nd, 3rd, 4th place against the market leader is exhausting. Much easier to just steer that customer into an ICE vehicle with a couple FUD statements about range and battery life, and then presto, their ICE vehicle is an easier sale.
Meanwhile Tesla sales reps and marketing materials, and demo centers are 100% all-in on EVs.

 

[LUXMAN]

Compared to the Cybertruck AWD, the Ford Lightning ER is:
Faster
Lighter
Cheaper
Actually available 18 months ago.
Larger battery
Faster charging curve 20-80%
Larger interior.
Larger total cargo volume.
Bad volume is within a couple of cubic feet.
What is a Cybertruck driver going to put in those last cubic feet up near the window? Won't it jam the cover from retracting?
Is available with dozens of types of bed covers - more versatile.
Has thousands of 3rd party manufactures who make compatible accessories including things like recovery winches, snow plows, in-bed storage systems, toolboxes, bike racks, kyak racks, motorcycle chocks, gun racks and gun safes,
Comes in 12 factory colors, 9 for no added charge. None cost $6500.
Also has electric rack and pinion steering.
Comes with a spare tire standard.
Does not show fingerprints.
You can actually see out the back. Good luck backing the CT in the rain.
Available towing mirrors.
Available sliding rear window
Available opening sun roof.
Available safe.
Availalble tailgate step

Towing is 11,000 vs 10,000. What do you actually tow at 11k with a 1/2 ton class EV, bro?

Rear steering -Turn Radius is only like 4 ft smaller on a truck that is already shorter. Seems like Tesla is making up for some bad engineering on the front with more cost/weight/failure points in the back. Maybe just learn how to park a truck?

Stainless steel - Tesla wasted all the weight savings from their giga castings and structural battery pack to make the truck bullet proof. Seems like a gimmick. Maybe consider finding a new place to live if you need a bullet proof truck? Steel slab sides is like battleship technology. Ford's "innovative" aluminum skin actually saves weight.


Even the F150L Pro version is just as fast as the CT AWD and only costs $49k.

Right. Except we might need the bulletproof thing everywhere pretty soon.

 

[Txxthie]

Not sure I follow on the "software-defined vehicle" lowering cost.
The software is much more of an added functionality and value. A lot of what Tesla enthusiasts talk about being valuable in their cars are all the software features.
But software is hella expensive to make the first copy. You need to divide that cost with volume (ala Microsoft or Apple). Until the other manufacturers go all-in on software being part of the product they are selling and become more vertically integrated as also being software companies, they are not going to be able to compete on the software.

Watch the video, it defines what is a software defined vehicle. The legacies are playing a different game at this time. ICE subsidizes BEV development and losses. Unless there is a break thru in battery chemistry, it is not a sustainable business model. Toyota was wise to stay in the PHEV lane until battery costs are reduced.

John McElroy (Autoline)
"Tesla has shown the way it's going to go forward and it goes way beyond just putting batteries in cars. Everything based on first principles, everything being a software defined vehicle, using zonal centralized computing, developed using digital twins. The automotive Legacies are not there! They are doing little bits and pieces and trying to bring the entire legacy supply chain along with them. It's extraordinarily difficult to do this."

Tesla has an advantage in thermodynamics, drivetrain, charging, batteries, metallurgy, manufacturing, cost, lack of debt, and engineers (Space X/Tesla). Legacy will also continue to struggle due to the Peter Principle, Unions, and not having a technology DNA.

Software is a competitive advantage. It has been very lucrative over the past 10+ years. "Why Software is Eating the World". Andreessen-Horowitz nailed it in 2011" https://a16z.com/why-software-is-eating-the-world/

Apple and Microsoft are now the #1 and #2 most valuable companies in the world. Tesla will surpass both, if the moonshots FSD and Optimus are successful. Tesla is currently being valued as if there is a 30% chance that will happen.

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