F-150 Lightning outsells the CT in Q4

[broncoaz]

I did my part to bolster the Lightning’s sales numbers with my new lease.

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[TaxmanHog]

This.

Ford EVs need to move 800V ASAP. You don't even need Taycan tech... the Hyundai/Kia/Genesis E-GMP EVs already have wickedly fast charging curves. I owned an Ioniq 5 Limited and Mach-E at the same time and the Ioniq was 2-3x faster (230 kW vs. 90-100 kW).

Hope Jim Farley knows this and has his engineers working on fast charging curve for future Lightnings and Mach-Es.

I love my Lightning, but would be delighted if my next one had what you describe with the Ioniq.

Hopefully T3 will have this architecture.

 

[Bills R Electric]

Hopefully T3 will have this architecture.

According to Grok:

The Ford F-150 Lightning's successor, codenamed Project T3, is expected to be available in the second half of 2027. The truck will be built at Ford's BlueOval City facility in Tennessee

The T3 will have a range of up to 420 miles on a single charge, advanced aerodynamics, and upgraded charging capability.

I would like it at least a year sooner than that...but if they do hit the milestones of faster charging, a range of 420 miles, while not raising the price, it should be one helluva vehicle.

 

[Grease Lightning]

Don't think that'll happen in the current iteration due to the sub-400v battery packs. Current superchargers/EA 350's max out at 500 amps so you're pretty much limited to under 200 kW. Believe the ones used at the Ionnca Rechargies are 600 amp but doubt the thermals on the lightning would like that very much. Ford could possibly adjust the curve and give the 500 amp boost for longer but that's about all current lightning owners can expect.

We can dream and pray….

 

[MichaelCA]

the cybertruck now qualifies for 7.5K starting Jan 1st until if President Trump decides to can the rebate system. Also the Lightning loses its 7.5k? IIRC due the locally sourced battery requirement.

 

[TaxmanHog]

the cybertruck now qualifies for 7.5K starting Jan 1st until if President Trump decides to can the rebate system. Also the Lightning loses its 7.5k? IIRC due the locally sourced battery requirement.

https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/tax2023.shtml

 

[MichaelCA]

https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/tax2023.shtml

my mistake. I thought i read it on this forum that the lightning wont qualify 2025.

 

[PJnc284]

my mistake. I thought i read it on this forum that the lighting wont qualify 2025.

They jumped the gun on the initial communication and came back with an updated one. Still curious why the Pro doesn't qualify.

 

[Firn]

Just like how GM uses 400v to drive, but 800v to charge, Ford certainly could update the pack to offer faster charging in the Lightning platform.

Frankly, IMO, Ford needs to worry less about T3 and more about the Lightning. They have a win in offering a regular truck, but as electric. Just update the dang thing. Give it a mid cycle refresh to update the design to match the current F150 (the Lightning is the 2020 design). Ditch the milk jug light bar and go with a slim DRL of a similar idea, but using the Gas F150 design.
And they can also update the battery to offer the 400v/800v split. Added range would be tough, but faster charging would significantly alleviate that concern.

Maybe Ford needs to T3, to Trust The Truck, the truck they have now. They have a good truck, don't give up on it, move forward with it!

 

[ECal]

I hope the Lightning outsells the Cyber yuk in 2025 as well.

I would assume the market for folks who want a cybertruck is quite small at this point. The dealership near me had at least 20 on the lot.

The venn diagram of people who can afford one and people who like them is small and I would think most in that subset have one already.

 

[Bills R Electric]

Just like how GM uses 400v to drive, but 800v to charge, Ford certainly could update the pack to offer faster charging in the Lightning platform.

Frankly, IMO, Ford needs to worry less about T3 and more about the Lightning. They have a win in offering a regular truck, but as electric. Just update the dang thing. Give it a mid cycle refresh to update the design to match the current F150 (the Lightning is the 2020 design). Ditch the milk jug light bar and go with a slim DRL of a similar idea, but using the Gas F150 design.
And they can also update the battery to offer the 400v/800v split. Added range would be tough, but faster charging would significantly alleviate that concern.

Maybe Ford needs to T3, to Trust The Truck, the truck they have now. They have a good truck, don't give up on it, move forward with it!

Agreed.

I don't know enough about their battery supplier, and the cost of the battery pack and componentry, but I imagine that is the bottleneck on improving charging.

The idea with the eventually T3 is Ford will be more control of the battery supply chain.

That said, bring it on. Faster charging would really make the existing Lightning a strong seller, IMO.

 

[Bills R Electric]

I would assume the market for folks who want a cybertruck is quite small at this point. The dealership near me had at least 20 on the lot.

The venn diagram of people who can afford one and people who like them is small and I would think most in that subset have one already.

This seems to be playing out.
I had a reservation since Nov 2019.
This month I finally cancelled and got my $100 deposit back.
I did test drive one (a Foundation Series) and it didn't make sense to pay $100,000+ for it.

 

[Magendi]

Just like how GM uses 400v to drive, but 800v to charge, Ford certainly could update the pack to offer faster charging in the Lightning platform.

Frankly, IMO, Ford needs to worry less about T3 and more about the Lightning. They have a win in offering a regular truck, but as electric. Just update the dang thing. Give it a mid cycle refresh to update the design to match the current F150 (the Lightning is the 2020 design). Ditch the milk jug light bar and go with a slim DRL of a similar idea, but using the Gas F150 design.
And they can also update the battery to offer the 400v/800v split. Added range would be tough, but faster charging would significantly alleviate that concern.

Maybe Ford needs to T3, to Trust The Truck, the truck they have now. They have a good truck, don't give up on it, move forward with it!

Spot on. I love my lightning and thought very hard about the GMC for better range and faster charging. Ultimately, I prefer the lightning in every way over the GMC except for the range and charging advantage that GMC has. And honestly, I could happily live with current range if the charging stops were more like 20 minutes instead of close to 40 min. In fact, given how rarely I (and most owners) need to charge en route somewhere, not carrying around a massive 200 kWh pack is an advantage to the lightning if only they could make it charge faster on those road trips.

If I regularly towed anything more than 100 miles I would for sure want the biggest battery pack available but for me that’s a non-issue.

 

[Firn]

Spot on. I love my lightning and thought very hard about the GMC for better range and faster charging. Ultimately, I prefer the lightning in every way over the GMC except for the range and charging advantage that GMC has. And honestly, I could happily live with current range if the charging stops were more like 20 minutes instead of close to 40 min. In fact, given how rarely I (and most owners) need to charge en route somewhere, not carrying around a massive 200 kWh pack is an advantage to the lightning if only they could make it charge faster on those road trips.

If I regularly towed anything more than 100 miles I would for sure want the biggest battery pack available but for me that’s a non-issue.

100%!!

With regard to range, I wish Ford would take the risk and try and build an trailer side range extender connection standard.
RARELY do I need the range. But when i do I would want to RENT a range extender. Something like a propane generator that can sit in the bed or on the trailer tongue and provide about 30kw to the drive system. Unless I towed every week it would make more sense to rent an extender when needed than buy twice the battery and not need it for 80% of the time. The new range extending hybrids are similar, but i would rather rent the engine when needed than buy it and not need it most of the time.

Until someone steps up and sets a standard (patent it and immediately open source it) we won't get it.



Edit, thinking of the math here.
With an ER towing you get what, 100 miles of range, or about 1mi/kwh, at 70mph. At 70mph you could drive for just under an hour and a half. Add a 30kw range extender and you could add 30 miles an hour to that. Over an hour and a half it would add 45 miles, so 145 miles, but it's also running during those 45 miles, so add another 15 miles, etc. Give or take you might get 180-200 miles between DCFC sessions.

Looks like a 100lb propane tank would give just under 5 hours of runtime.
https://masteraire.com/collections/generators/products/30-kw-natural-gas-propane-generator-mg30reg

 

[JMD359]

I hope Ford (or any EV maker to be honest) can improve their charging to match the Taycan.

That would make a big difference in the ownership experience of an EV.

Trucks won’t ever be there , durability is far more important in a pickup than a Porsche , Battery pack on the Porsche is just like its gas engines , very high output and short life . Our pickups are built to last not go and charge fast , just my .02c

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