Preconditioning battery for L3 charging

[RickLightning]

Well of course I didn't save the screen for the coldest test that I did on my most recent trip but here it is on a chilly morning before plugging in with a Tesla magic dock station selected as the destination. With climate control off I could see the coolant heater was taking 2kW. I have seen it take 7kW. Now is it doing it for pre-conditioning or something else I'm not sure.

Unfortunately I did not happen to take a screen shot for exactly the case that we want which is before plugging in, but I did look a couple of times and it seemed to me like it was on based on the numbers that I was looking at.

It was a very short drive to the magic dock so it did not have time to warm up much. I'm also pretty sure that when I didn't put it in as a destination I did not get pre-heating, and it took between five and ten minutes to get up to "full" charging speed.

You cannot precondition to a Tesla charger at this point.

 

[Newton]

You cannot precondition to a Tesla charger at this point.

This was a Tesla magic dock in Forks, WA which is shown as CCS and appears in the list of nearby chargers (which is pretty small in Forks.)

 

[RickLightning]

This was a Tesla magic dock in Forks, WA which is shown as CCS and appears in the list of nearby chargers (which is pretty small in Forks.)

Still can't condition to it to my understanding.

 

[TomB985]

You're the only one that believes this. When you made this point previously, others pointed out that they believed you to be wrong. Someone asked for proof, and I posted something Ford had put out ABOUT THE LIGHTNING:

https://www.f150lightningforum.com/forum/threads/a2z-tesla-and-charge-fault.18671/post-383938

He’s not the only one. I’ve tried in January and April and never noticed any kind of change. Zero action from the compressor or coolant heater as I approached numerous chargers, and the battery inlet temp did nothing.

I can’t say if my truck was capable of preconditioning before January, but it certainly can’t now. Nothing is mentioned in the owner’s manual or any official documentation, so I think preconditioning is a myth.

You may disagree, but @mparz00 isn’t the only one to think this. I hope Ford proves me wrong with a software update.

 

[mb0220]

Here's a question that questions the question itself. Bear with my while I lay this out.

I don't hate the FordNav, but there are several other apps I prefer in general. The only reason I may use FordNav are (1) to get a better range estimate, or (2) for preconditioning the battery before DCFC.

#1 - I can live without that. I find it to be an insignificant improvement to an otherwise unreliable number. (Please tell me if your experience suggests otherwise!)

#2 - (Let's assume it works.) Looking at some of the other posts here with charts, it appears as though battery warming begins as soon as DCFC starts, so while your fist 5 minutes may be slower than optimal, after that period you're up to the speed you would be if you had preconditioned.

So if we're only talking about saving 5 minutes (and that's assuming it works) then maybe I'm better off just not worrying about it at all and using the apps that I like.

What say you?

 

[TaxmanHog]

So if we're only talking about saving 5 minutes (and that's assuming it works) then maybe I'm better off just not worrying about it at all and using the apps that I like.

What say you?

Probably so, what are your average temps in the part of Oregon you travel most, any severe cold?

 

[TomB985]

#2 - (Let's assume it works.) Looking at some of the other posts here with charts, it appears as though battery warming begins as soon as DCFC starts, so while your fist 5 minutes may be slower than optimal, after that period you're up to the speed you would be if you had preconditioned.

That has nothing to do with navigation. Once you plug in, the truck aggressively tries to get the battery to the optimal temp for charging whether you navigate there or not.

 

[mb0220]

Probably so, what are your average temps in the part of Oregon you travel most, any severe cold?

Not like Wiscosin severe, but we do take some long trips for skiing where the temps are usually around the 20s (occasionally high teens).

 

[mb0220]

That has nothing to do with navigation. Once you plug in, the truck aggressively tries to get the battery to the optimal temp for charging whether you navigate there or not.

Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying, but I worded it poorly. Seems there is not a whole lot of benefit to the precondition since the battery warms aggressively once you start charging anyway. Shaves a few minutes off your charge time maybe, but for a 3-hour trip a few extra minutes doesn't move the needle for me.

 

[Webbo85]

I honestly felt like it was working this winter. Drove up to Vermont in 10F weather, with an EA station in the Ford Navigation, I got 178kW charge speed within 2 minutes of plugging in. I haven't gotten those speeds that quickly when just pulling up. No hard data to prove it, could have been it was a newer station I guess. Coming home in 30F weather, mapped in Ford Nav to same station I got 188kw. I assumed it was working with how quickly it got up to speed in those temps.

 

[mb0220]

I honestly felt like it was working this winter. Drove up to Vermont in 10F weather, with an EA station in the Ford Navigation, I got 178kW charge speed within 2 minutes of plugging in. I haven't gotten those speeds that quickly when just pulling up. No hard data to prove it, could have been it was a newer station I guess. Coming home in 30F weather, mapped in Ford Nav to same station I got 188kw. I assumed it was working with how quickly it got up to speed in those temps.

How long does it take to reach that speed with no precondition?

 

[Webbo85]

How long does it take to reach that speed with no precondition?

Honestly, no idea. But for me, it was minimal effort to put it in Ford Nav, and I still had Waze running on the phone. If it saved me 5 minutes on the charge, still worth it for me. But I get your earlier point, for some it may not matter. We've all heard the horror stories or seen the videos of brutally slow speeds in super cold temps, so anything that might help the speed that doesn't really inconvenience me is worth a shot personally.

 

[Zprime29]

July '23 I definitely saw the battery temp on the dash move from far right of the middle, to peg the middle by the time I reached the DCFC location. It was well over 100F, middle of the day, middle of the desert. I haven't traveled in temps since then where the battery meter was not in the middle. We'll be heading out again this summer, I'll keep an eye on it. I found my OBDII so I'll see if I can get a temp log recorded on that trip. Gives me a few months to see if I can duplicate @mr.Magoo's setup.

 

[RickLightning]

How long does it take to reach that speed with no precondition?

It depends on the temperature of the battery. I can tell you that on my recent trips, I could clearly see the energy (8-9kW) going to the battery at the DC fast chargers, and the charging very slowly climbing. Of course as your SOC increases, it's also slowing...

As for time saved, I recently took a 22 day trip driving 5,300 miles. I DC fast charged roughly 40 times. If only 5 minutes was saved (it's more), that would be 200 minutes I'd get back on 1 trip.

 

[potato]

#2 - (Let's assume it works.) Looking at some of the other posts here with charts, it appears as though battery warming begins as soon as DCFC starts, so while your fist 5 minutes may be slower than optimal, after that period you're up to the speed you would be if you had preconditioned.

So if we're only talking about saving 5 minutes (and that's assuming it works) then maybe I'm better off just not worrying about it at all and using the apps that I like.

When I was watching the coolant heater draw via OBD during DCFC, it seemed to take more like 15 minutes to get battery temperature up to 19 C where the heater shuts off. (Of course depends on weather and how cold/hot your battery is to start with.) So probably more than 5 minutes to get to the same speed as with preconditioning... it wouldn't surprise me if the total time it saves was under 5 minutes though.

So bottom line I reached the same conclusion. It would be nice to have working, but not worth worrying about. And then there's the hassle of having to find your charger and plug it into the nav.

All this could be avoided with a "precondition now" button, but I guess that's crazy talk.

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