Sign our Petition to Make Tesla Superchargers and Plugs the U.S. Standard

[Nick Gerteis]

Thank you guys so much for bringing this silly argument over here. Saves me much time by not having to hop over to electrek and read it over there for the. umpteenth. time.

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[theblunden]

Someone should start a petition on them calling a front trunk a frunk

 

[jefro]

In England they'd call it a Fronnit or a Froot?

 

[duncanmaio]

In England they'd call it a Fronnit.

No, a front boot would be a Froot.

 

[vandy1981]

I suspect until we get a mandated North American standard the public charging infrastructure will remain in shambles. I suppose the problem is the governmental agency that has jurisdiction over charging. Until congress mandates which governmental agency has that authority it won't happen. The DOT probably makes the most sense as the regulatory agency.

CCS1 is already the de facto charging standard in the USA. This will be even more true as bipartisan infrastructure bill funding is implemented since grantees will have to commit to using CCS1 connectors in their builds.

The Tesla connector is more elegant and probably marginally superior but CCS1 gets the job done.

Can we start a petition to send Musk to Mars?

 

[Amps]

Can we start a petition to send Musk to Mars?

if he’s looked at the Twitter lawsuit, he may already be halfway there. It’s brutal.

 

[FlasherZ]

if he’s looked at the Twitter lawsuit, he may already be halfway there. It’s brutal.

I predict he ends up buying Twitter at $44.20 instead of $54.20 after they decide they don't want to roll the dice together on the Chancery Court. It's still a $5 premium per share compared to market value today.

 

[PungoteagueDave]

I can use Tesla destination chargers and it doesn't take a genius to look at plugshare for photos of damages at stations. See if you guys can use it.

I have driven over 225,000 Tesla miles, including several coast-to-coast road trips and at least a dozen trips up and down the east coast to/from Key West and south Florida from Virginia, have never seen a damaged Tesla connector. I have experienced a few chargers that did not work or had speed issues. Nothing like the continual problems being reported with connectivity and speed for the EA network.

 

[PungoteagueDave]

I predict he ends up buying Twitter at $44.20 instead of $54.20 after they decide they don't want to roll the dice together on the Chancery Court. It's still a $5 premium per share compared to market value today.

Agreed - this is just a pricing/negotiation tactic, nothing more - M&A 101.

 

[beatle]

I can use Tesla destination chargers and it doesn't take a genius to look at plugshare for photos of damages at stations. See if you guys can use it.

If a Tesla connector is vandalized, does that make the design inferior? Sheesh. Whatever you do, don't track how long it takes to get an EA station repaired.

I have yet to use a CCS plug myself, but seeing some of these videos of people charging their Lightning and Rivian makes the plug look very clunky. The DC "flap" is also a negative. With a Tesla connector just shove it in. It's basically impossible to get it wrong unless you don't push it all the way in.

 

[broncoaz]

Let’s go back to this.

 

[Theo1000]

Let’s go back to this.

Hah! Remember that one. Had to get rid of my Rav4 EV since I could not get part to repair my charger anymore.

Do I spot a GM EV-1 in the back ground. Are you one of the legendary owners. I had a bead on snagging one from a person moving abroad but could not pull it of.
................

Personally after over 20,000 miles on the highways with dcfc since 2014, almost 6 years, I have not seen any real CCS-1 connector issues. problems I have seen are mostly, payment, old software, cooling cables (I think 80% of the time it is the cooling cables), etc. There are 6 year old 50kw dcfc chargers that I still use occasionally on my I3. The plugs look/work just fine.

This is just another way for uncle musk to grab more money.

I think we can safely ignore this BS made up by TSLA nonsense.

 

[broncoaz]

Hah! Remember that one. Had to get rid of my Rav4 EV since I could not get part to repair my charger anymore.

Do I spot a GM EV-1 in the back ground. Are you one of the legendary owners. I had a bead on snagging one from a person moving abroad but could not pull it of.
................

Personally after over 20,000 miles on the highways with dcfc since 2014, almost 6 years, I have not seen any real CCS-1 connector issues. problems I have seen are mostly, payment, old software, cooling cables (I think 80% of the time it is the cooling cables), etc. There are 6 year old 50kw dcfc chargers that I still use occasionally on my I3. The plugs look/work just fine.

This is just another way for uncle musk to grab more money.

I think we can safely ignore this BS made up by TSLA nonsense.

I grabbed the pic of the EV1 charger off the web, not mine. I tried but couldn’t get one of the original EV1 chargers from a Saturn dealership in Tempe, AZ when it closed down in 2009, the dealership owner kept it for himself. I thought it would be a cool piece, like the old gas pumps of the EV era.

 

[Krypto]

My petition is to sell GM to Tesla.
Second petition is to sell Ford to Tesla.

Then have Federal money for Rivian so they can sell their truck for $25K.

Sell Rivian to Tesla too, after all why bother to have any other automaker on the Road? Elon makes the best and greatest bar none, now and in the future. Tesla cars should suffice for all. Hope your post was just as sarcastic as mine.

 

[swesson]

I concede that Combo/CCS is winning at this point - and so does Tesla. We're going to have to live with that stupid monstrosity. Time for a history lesson though, so we know how we got here:

In the beginning, the J1772 standard was created, and it was a standard looking for an application as very, very few EV's existed. The SAE mostly focused on the electric part, and as "everyone knows you don't power general vehicles using electricity", they didn't spend time on the industrial or usability design. The net result is that we ended up with a design-by-committee approach with a poor connector. The user must align the connector near-perfectly, and avoid twisting as the ring will break off and pins can bend. Just head to the St. Louis airport and look at the charge handles there, EVERY ONE of the J1772 connectors from three different manufacturers, has the surrounding alignment ring broken off from heavy use.

The Tesla connector is more compact, elegant, self-centering, and allows for alignment error of 15 degrees or greater, which is necessary for those with physical disabilities or poorer motor skills. For AC level 2 charging, it even used the same signaling as J1772 so the two would be compatible with appropriate adapters. Moreover, it achieved compact reuse for AC & DCFC charging unified in a single connector. The only thing missing from the Tesla connector? 3-phase charging that is required in Europe for more than 4 kW (which is why Europe ended up with the Mennekes connector, only slightly better than the J1772 connector because of its longer straight keying surface). It can even do 800V charging, when coupled with the appropriate wire insulation/cable.

So, enter Nissan and ChaDeMo... Nissan used J1772 for AC and ChaDeMo for DCFC, and was gaining significant adoption as well for both charge stations. Tesla even produced an adapter for it (that I use to this day).

It was then that the SAE saw the need to update the standards to include DCFC. But unfortunately, they were suffering from a bit too much of "not invented here" to consider the market as it sat. ChaDeMo (the majority DCFC standard back then) didn't support AC charging, so the SAE ruled that out as a base. And the SAE also made it a requirement to build upon the existing J1772 standard, which is why you have a J1772 plug with two extra pins stuck at the bottom. From a design standpoint, we have the "if all you have is a hammer..." point that led to most connectors looking like gas pump handles -- whether ChaDeMo, J1772, or Combo-CCS. And finally, you have that whole competition thing -- other companies hated that Tesla would have a head start and lobbied throughout the process to neuter first-mover advantage. SAE engineers were too proud of their poor J1772 legacy.

It is said that the porn industry is what allowed VHS to carry a win against a superior Betamax product. It seems that unfortunately, SAE engineers found the pornography stash in its pursuit of a charging connector standard.

This is a very accurate synopsis of the history. Thanks for providing it. Standards are messy and the best products often don't win. As an early Tesla owner, I know that I will have more connection challenges with the Lightning CCS/J1772 than I had with the Tesla connector. I do like to see the increased adoption of EV's in the last 7 years since I bought my first one though.

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