Charge Station Pro and Home Integration System self-install

[PiMatrix]

First, this is a great idea to consolidate this discussion into a single thread that could provide sticky reference document a solutions vetted by members of this forum much smarter than me. Thank you for starting this thread!

Two thoughts at this moment.

1. I have read concerns in various threads about the fact the 240V outlet from the Lightning provides power using a bonded neutral, and that may cause issues if it feeds to a Critical Load Panel provided with a manual interlock breaker arrangement. The concern raised is tripping of any GFI circuits…..I have no idea!

So I'm an electrical engineer not an electrician but here is my understanding on #1. The bed of the Lightning was designed as a mobile power platform which is why ground and neutral are connected (bonded neutral). Many mobile work generators are wired the same way. This causes many GFCI problems and violates code if you plug the L1, L2, GND and Neutral directly into your home manual interlocked switch panel or a transfer switch as most all panels have neutral to ground bonded which then goes to two copper earth rod near your house. Neutral should be bonded to ground in one place or one can get ground loops just due to stray magnetic fields from wires carrying current running near each other. This causes ground fault havoc with GFCI protection circuits.

So on many generators like my diesel Honda bonded neutral you can disconnect the neutral wire that is bonded to the chassis and as long as you have permanently connected the power to house, you are fine as the neutral is bonded to ground at the panel and GFCI will work fine. The other options is only buy a generator with a non bonded neutral. However the manufacturers sometimes give instructions on how to convert one to the other by taking the neutral off the chassis ground.

So back to the Lightning, I'm not certain where Ford makes the ground to neutral connection. Maybe a disable switch could be installed for those times you are using to only backpower the house via the truck bed. However this is outside my pay grade but I bet it could be done. Of course it would be important to switch it back to neutral bonded whenever not connected to house to provide proper connection to the GFCI outlets and say power tools. However I would not recommend this approach without Fords blessing . SInce the bonded neutral of the onboard inverter is an OSHA requirement for work generators, Ford could theoretically make the system non-bonded neutral for home grid tie in. Not likely since they have the HIS and one can always use an extension cord multistrip on the bed for emergency home power.

I should mention that many people move the ground wire to the neutral at the male plug end extension cord to eliminate the ground faults since there is now only one path back to GFCI on the truck. Basically the ground in the house is not connected to the truck ground but instead by the Neutral. So clearly the truck will not throw a fault. Question is will house item GFCI's still function? This does break NEC code but it is still done by many people in an emergency. It is considered unsafe by some and very safe by others equally licensed.

So the better ways to accomplish this... CLearly the HIS solves this issue because you send DC from the batteries and then it inverts to AC at the HIS and the HIS probably relies on the panel neutral bonded setup. Without the HIS and just a transfer switch between the Lightning bed and your panel here is the way to avoid the truck GFCI... A neutral switching transfer switch that switches between L1, L2, AND N of the main panel OR the Lightning 240V bed outlet to the emergency 7.2KW (30A x 2) load subpanel. So the load Neutral will get it's ground from the main panel when you are on grid power, and from the truck when you are on truck backup power. Generally sub-panels are not neutral bonded in panel, this is all done back at the main panel.

Anyway, a long winded simplified explanation to bonded neutrals I hope!

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[yed19]

What I think would be great here is for someone to post a video of their system with the covers off the boxes once it is installed. I have always been suspicious that there has never been a video showing the actual system and how it works. I would love to see Ask This Old House do something on these types of system (or a P2EV youtuber, or something... If Ford had a working version of it up, wouldn't you think we would see it somewhere or is their marketing that bad?

 

[Firestop]

So I'm an electrical engineer not an electrician but here is my understanding on #1. The bed of the Lightning was designed as a mobile power platform which is why ground and neutral are connected (bonded neutral). Many mobile work generators are wired the same way. This causes many GFCI problems and violates code if you plug the L1, L2, GND and Neutral directly into your home manual interlocked switch panel or a transfer switch as most all panels have neutral to ground bonded which then goes to two copper earth rod near your house. Neutral should be bonded to ground in one place or one can get ground loops just due to stray magnetic fields from wires carrying current running near each other. This causes ground fault havoc with GFCI protection circuits.

So on many generators like my diesel Honda bonded neutral you can disconnect the neutral wire that is bonded to the chassis and as long as you have permanently connected the power to house, you are fine as the neutral is bonded to ground at the panel and GFCI will work fine. The other options is only buy a generator with a non bonded neutral. However the manufacturers sometimes give instructions on how to convert one to the other by taking the neutral off the chassis ground.

So back to the Lightning, I'm not certain where Ford makes the ground to neutral connection. Maybe a disable switch could be installed for those times you are using to only backpower the house via the truck bed. However this is outside my pay grade but I bet it could be done. Of course it would be important to switch it back to neutral bonded whenever not connected to house to provide proper connection to the GFCI outlets and say power tools. However I would not recommend this approach

So the better ways to accomplish this... CLearly the HIS solves this issue because you send DC from the batteries and then it inverts to AC at the HIS and the HIS probably relies on the panel neutral bonded setup. Without the HIS and just a transfer switch between the Lightning bed and your panel here is the way to avoid the truck GFCI... A transfer switch that switches between L1, L2, AND N of the main panel OR the Lightning 240V bed outlet to the emergency 7.2KW (30A x 2) load subpanel. So the load Neutral will get it's ground from the main panel when you are on grid power, and from the truck when you are on truck backup power. Generally sub-panels are not neutral bonded in panel, this is all done back at the main panel.

Anyway, a long winded simplified explanation to bonded neutrals I hope!

Thanks..your explanation helped add more context to my research on this topic. I had my house wired with the CLP and NEMA 14-50 connector for a portable generator in-feed 14 yrs ago when I built the house; however, the topic of bonded and floating neutrals never brought to my attention. Now a wiser man, it will be discussed with my electrician when he comes back out to install the FCSP.

It will be intereating………..

 

[PiMatrix]

The possibilities....

 

[hturnerfamily]

We're finding out that the PRO Charger is simply a 'fancier' and larger EVSE Charger for the Lightning, or basically any other EV with a full CCS inlet on their vehicle - while it 'looks' like it provides more than the typical 240v J1772 charge cable - it only provides the ability of more amperage.

Yes, it will provide is the ability to then integrate the mentioned HIS 'whole house' power feedback system, although we have learned that this also requires a LOT MORE expensive equipment to bring to fruition.

Many of us 'like' the idea of whole house capabilities, although most of us probably also have come to the conclusion that it's not a deal-breaker to accomplish this the less 'automated' way - since it's likely that the need will be very, very infrequent.

The reality is that even if the PRO Charger is bundled with your truck, you don't 'have' to use it - the Mobile Charger with 240v at 30amps is certainly capable, and a lot less likely to break the budget, and more readily available to be accessed in typical home wiring scenarios.

 

[Tony Burgh]

We're finding out that the PRO Charger is simply a 'fancier' and larger EVSE Charger for the Lightning, or basically any other EV with a full CCS inlet on their vehicle - while it 'looks' like it provides more than the typical 240v J1772 charge cable - it only provides the ability of more amperage.

Yes, it will provide is the ability to then integrate the mentioned HIS 'whole house' power feedback system, although we have learned that this also requires a LOT MORE expensive equipment to bring to fruition.

Many of us 'like' the idea of whole house capabilities, although most of us probably also have come to the conclusion that it's not a deal-breaker to accomplish this the less 'automated' way - since it's likely that the need will be very, very infrequent.

The reality is that even if the PRO Charger is bundled with your truck, you don't 'have' to use it - the Mobile Charger with 240v at 30amps is certainly capable, and a lot less likely to break the budget, and more readily available to be accessed in typical home wiring scenarios.

The quick advantage is that you can hardwire it and not have a device designed for mobile and temporary service doing yeoman’s work. How long before the four prong 240v adapter no longer fits snug? Why does Ford suggest a robust 14-50 receptacle?
Just wire the FCSP for 32 or 48 amp service and you have a solid charger at the installation cost of a low amperage one that would require an added expense to purchase. And the future capability to feed DC from the truck to an inverter if you wish.

 

[colonel K]

I will be wiring my Charge Station Pro from a different circuit breaker box from my home box, so won't be able to use the home integration option. Given this restriction, It looks like I will only be using the 48 amp charging. From reviewing the above PDFs, It looks like I will need to do the following:

- Use a 60 amp breaker
- Use 6 gauge (6/3) wiring
- Set the switch to 5 to the 48 amp setting.

Does this seem like a reasonable solution?

 

[Tony Burgh]

I will be wiring my Charge Station Pro from a different circuit breaker box from my home box, so won't be able to use the home integration option. Given this restriction, It looks like I will only be using the 48 amp charging. From reviewing the above PDFs, It looks like I will need to do the following:

- Use a 60 amp breaker
- Use 6 gauge (6/3) wiring
- Set the switch to 5 to the 48 amp setting.

Does this seem like a reasonable solution?

It’s one option that I looked at. The negative aspect is the large FCSP box and the heavy charge cord. Just think of it as overdesigned for your needs.

 

[Yellow Buddy]

So I'm an electrical engineer not an electrician but here is my understanding on #1. The bed of the Lightning was designed as a mobile power platform which is why ground and neutral are connected (bonded neutral). Many mobile work generators are wired the same way. This causes many GFCI problems and violates code if you plug the L1, L2, GND and Neutral directly into your home manual interlocked switch panel or a transfer switch as most all panels have neutral to ground bonded which then goes to two copper earth rod near your house. Neutral should be bonded to ground in one place or one can get ground loops just due to stray magnetic fields from wires carrying current running near each other. This causes ground fault havoc with GFCI protection circuits.

So on many generators like my diesel Honda bonded neutral you can disconnect the neutral wire that is bonded to the chassis and as long as you have permanently connected the power to house, you are fine as the neutral is bonded to ground at the panel and GFCI will work fine. The other options is only buy a generator with a non bonded neutral. However the manufacturers sometimes give instructions on how to convert one to the other by taking the neutral off the chassis ground.

So back to the Lightning, I'm not certain where Ford makes the ground to neutral connection. Maybe a disable switch could be installed for those times you are using to only backpower the house via the truck bed. However this is outside my pay grade but I bet it could be done. Of course it would be important to switch it back to neutral bonded whenever not connected to house to provide proper connection to the GFCI outlets and say power tools. However I would not recommend this approach without Fords blessing . SInce the bonded neutral of the onboard inverter is an OSHA requirement for work generators, Ford could theoretically make the system non-bonded neutral for home grid tie in. Not likely since they have the HIS and one can always use an extension cord multistrip on the bed for emergency home power.

I should mention that many people move the ground wire to the neutral at the male plug end extension cord to eliminate the ground faults since there is now only one path back to GFCI on the truck. Basically the ground in the house is not connected to the truck ground but instead by the Neutral. So clearly the truck will not throw a fault. Question is will house item GFCI's still function? This does break NEC code but it is still done by many people in an emergency. It is considered unsafe by some and very safe by others equally licensed.

So the better ways to accomplish this... CLearly the HIS solves this issue because you send DC from the batteries and then it inverts to AC at the HIS and the HIS probably relies on the panel neutral bonded setup. Without the HIS and just a transfer switch between the Lightning bed and your panel here is the way to avoid the truck GFCI... A neutral switching transfer switch that switches between L1, L2, AND N of the main panel OR the Lightning 240V bed outlet to the emergency 7.2KW (30A x 2) load subpanel. So the load Neutral will get it's ground from the main panel when you are on grid power, and from the truck when you are on truck backup power. Generally sub-panels are not neutral bonded in panel, this is all done back at the main panel.

Anyway, a long winded simplified explanation to bonded neutrals I hope!

I plan on using the bed plug, but instead of going directly into my home panel I’ll be buffering it with an existing SMA Sunny Island.

If folks are looking for a cheaper alternative you can use 3rd party inverters. My Sunny Island allows bonded neutrals as it isolates the home panel form the generator, as well as acts as a built in transfer switch, support its own grid, and will allow the solar inverters to keep operating.

That would be option #3 - tie into an existing system.

 

[PiMatrix]

HIS FAQ -

Dealer Application FAQ

Q: Where can my Home Integration System be installed?​ A: This varies by home. The Home Integration System may be installed on the outside of your house near where the electrical service comes into your home. Another option may be to install it inside the garage. If you are in the Northeast region of the country, the best place may be in your basement.​ Q: What are the clearance requirements for the Home Integration System placement?​ A: In total, you will need 48 inches of height and 54 inches of width for an accurate mount. You must allow 6 inches of clearance around each piece of equipment and install a minimum of 39 inches off the ground.​ Q: The wiring in my house is old, how will I know if it’s compatible with the Home Integration System?​ A: We recommend using a licensed electrician to survey your home and evaluate if any updates are necessary.​ Q: How does my vehicle back up my home?​ A: Power flows from your Ford F-150 Lightning via the Charge Station Pro to the Home Integration System, into the backed up loads panel.​ Q: When the power goes out, do I have to do anything to turn on Ford Intelligent Backup Power?​ A: You will need the Home Integration System installed and set up at your home. Your Charge Station Pro will need to be configured in the Ford Pass App, and your Ford F-150 Lightning must be charged and plugged into the Charge Station Pro.​ Q: Once a power outage is over, do I have to do anything with my Home Integration System?​ A: No, your home will automatically return to grid power after the grid stabilizes.​

 

[Maquis]

I will be wiring my Charge Station Pro from a different circuit breaker box from my home box, so won't be able to use the home integration option. Given this restriction, It looks like I will only be using the 48 amp charging. From reviewing the above PDFs, It looks like I will need to do the following:

- Use a 60 amp breaker
- Use 6 gauge (6/3) wiring
- Set the switch to 5 to the 48 amp setting.

Does this seem like a reasonable solution?

You can install and use the HIS regardless of the type of panel feeding your CSP and regardless of its amp setting.

 

[PiMatrix]

You can install and use the HIS regardless of the type of panel feeding your CSP and regardless of its amp setting.

I received a ship notice on the HIS today 2 months ahead of the original ship date. Already received the Charger Pro from another person not installing as they already have a charger installed from another vehicle. Gave up on the Sunrun install, just too difficult for many reasons. I tried. Those who have gone that path know what I'm talking about. Next step, read manuals, permit pull and order materials. My friend is an electrician so will order what I need and do the required inspections. Has to be less expensive than the 4K+ sunrun wanted. I'll take that $4K and credit it to the missing options on my platinum order to make up for Fords inept customer care. (OK, eventually I will stop venting I promise)

I'll document things as I learn them. Apparently only two customer HIS have been installed according to the excellent Munro and Jim Farley video posted this week. Sunrun gave me the same number of installs completed but I thought that was local, guess not. One reason I didn't want a Sunrun hired local subcontractor who had never done before doing the install.

Link to the Munro, Farley, Zhang, Field video in case you have not seen. They are an impressive group of leaders and they have a difficult task to ramp especially with all the EV competition on way. There is a small interesting section on the HIS and Charger Pro.



We have Enphase solar going in as well so reason we wanted to get all this work done before that project starts up as can't have two electrical permits overlapping.

 

[PiMatrix]

It's real! Well two of three boxes arrived.

 

[adoublee]

It's real! Well two of three boxes arrived.

Send pics with covers off!!!

 

[Wombat]

Here is what it looks like with panels off, still working out the wiring. Still waiting on my pro charger to arrive.

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