12 volt warning in cold while plugged in

[RickLightning]

In case I decide to do the same, is it AGM battery?

Yes.

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[PV2EV]

Yes, that's how I now keep my LVB above 70% SOC. My truck is parked in an insulated attached garage that's usually not too much different from our house temperature.

When plugged in and running in accessory mode, even though my HVB is at its charging limit to start with, the charging port LEDs are blue, and the highest level filled blue LED is flashing as if the HVB were being charged - but the HVB started out and stays at its charging limit (50% most days for me). As I charge the LVB above 80%, the charger current drawn is only ~1 A, as measured by CarScanner. And since the LVB battery % SOC is constantly rising, most of that 1 A of current must end up in the LVB. IIRC, a previous post of @TaxmanHog cited Ford literature that (implied?) the charging current replenishes the HVB %SOC as it charges the LVB.

Letting the secured truck idle in accessory mode for 1/2 hr to ~1 hr per day is sufficient to keep your LVB charged up if, like me, you don't drive your truck a lot every day. My OBDII device is always plugged, so it's easy to read the LVB SOC. But as discovered in another thread, there's always your Ford.com dashboard, Ford Account Dashboard | Ford Owner Support. It may help to refresh your FordPass app and wait ~30 sec before checking LVB SOC at Ford.com.

Too bad the LVB is relatively small and drains so quickly. The more frequent recharging of a small battery probably means it wears out that much faster.

Weird, all I see is on the "dashboard / view all details" is a useless "Fuel = 0", "Oil = 100%", "tire pressure" and "mileage" ?

Where in FordPass can I find the LVB SOC?

Thanks!

 

[TaxmanHog]

Weird, all I see is on the "dashboard / view all details" is a useless "Fuel = 0", "Oil = 100%", "tire pressure" and "mileage" ?

Where in FordPass can I find the LVB SOC?

Thanks!

You can't

 

[PV2EV]

Every time you look in FordPass you're going to awaken the vehicle. Every time you pass close with a FOB or PaaK you're going to awaken the vehicle. Losing a few percentage points a day, i.e. 3 to 5%, is normal. The vehicle SHOULD recharge the 12v when it gets low, like 40%, without use. I just don't want it that low.

The lower you let it go, the longer it has to run to raise it up. For me, a Battery Tender solves the problem.

I was accidentally charged to 100% and I lowered for the location to 90%. Overnight it got to 15f (5f with wind chill) and I am now at 92% SOC, using FordPass only once...

 

[srspring551]

This gets more confusing the more posts I read about it. Sorry, my brain must be failing. It's a revelation to me, at least, that the Ford website dashboard SOC is the LVB (if I understand correctly from the above). So what are the best recommendations? I should try charging the LVB using Accessories mode, or with truck ON mode... with Shutown Timer off? With truck plugged in, or not? What other conditions must be set? These?: FOB and Paak out of range + don't look at FordPass + headlights off position + parking brake on + Frunk and tailgate closed . I bought a NOCO Genius2 tender charger recently, with the M6 ring connectors and I planned on attaching in battery compartment as described: https://www.f150lightningforum.com/forum/threads/charging-12v-battery.16979/#post-342220. (blue circles)

Do I need to have the Frunk shut? Will the tender power cord interfere or cause harm to Frunk? Another dumb Q: while the tender is running, I should have the truck OFF, and not in Accessories mode, right? If I'm downstream of the BMS sensor, I don't need to ever do a battery reset, yes? I see that some have connected the battery tender in the jump posts under the Frunk passenger cover (arrgh - all those clips!). Is that easier/better than the battery compartment?
This is true? "Driving it for a half-hour recharges your 12V battery back up above 80% so the update logic will allow the OTA to process... Updates need to maintain 12.6 to 13.6 volts."

What did I miss? Thanks for the help. (I'll check my BMS sensor part # later, and Fordpass + the truck don't say I have any updates pending but I guess that may not always be true)

 

[Mark Fox]

I assume this is what you are talking about? I had NO idea this was LVB SOC. I thought it is just wrong info for HVB SOC like many other places. Seriously, how am I suppose to know when it is right next to range with no specific label? In my defense in this case 52% HVB SOC getting me 96 miles is not that far off for standard battery pack. This was a big help (before the refresh, the info was four days old). Now if you can show me where to find this info on FordPass?

I seem to be loosing more than 10% SOC from LVB every day. Is this high?

I tried charging on accessories mode and didn’t work out well. It charged at slower rate and by the time it timed out, It added only 4% and when it timed out charging, something was still consuming power and it took it down much quicker than it was charging.

Having the truck completely on worked much better. It took half hour before it timed out and it added 10% in that time. It was at little over 15V and 1.2 amp coming out of HVB. By end of that half hour, it added 10%. and it was at 0.9 A and 15V. This was from 50% to 60% SOC. I think the current may be lower at higher SOC. Still much healthier than accessory mode that was in 14V territory and 0.6-9.0 A. Not sure if I should turn off power down timer and change it or just do 10% at a time. Do you know any downside in having the truck on for a longer period without driving it?

Yes, that's how I now keep my LVB above 70% SOC. My truck is parked in an insulated attached garage that's usually not too much different from our house temperature.

When plugged in and running in accessory mode, even though my HVB is at its charging limit to start with, the charging port LEDs are blue, and the highest level filled blue LED is flashing as if the HVB were being charged - but the HVB started out and stays at its charging limit (50% most days for me). As I charge the LVB above 80%, the charger current drawn is only ~1 A, as measured by CarScanner. And since the LVB battery % SOC is constantly rising, most of that 1 A of current must end up in the LVB. IIRC, a previous post of @TaxmanHog cited Ford literature that (implied?) the charging current replenishes the HVB %SOC as it charges the LVB.

Letting the secured truck idle in accessory mode for 1/2 hr to ~1 hr per day is sufficient to keep your LVB charged up if, like me, you don't drive your truck a lot every day. My OBDII device is always plugged, so it's easy to read the LVB SOC. But as discovered in another thread, there's always your Ford.com dashboard, Ford Account Dashboard | Ford Owner Support. It may help to refresh your FordPass app and wait ~30 sec before checking LVB SOC at Ford.com.

Too bad the LVB is relatively small and drains so quickly. The more frequent recharging of a small battery probably means it wears out that much faster.

Jim, I just wanted to thank you for the information you provided. I logged in to the account dashboard and found the information on my vehicles and was able to update the sync on my bronco sport. The Lightning was up to date with sync updates. Thanks again...

 

[PV2EV]

You can't

Got it. Per a another post in thread I see that it is on the homepage of the dashboard as SOC, which I thought was the HVB. Even with the tender I am at 92%...

 

[Maxx]

Anyone know how to put the truck to deep sleep manually?
Has anyone tried to turn off all connectivity functions to see if that cuts down on LVB power loss?

One of the attractive things about Lightning comparing to Rivian and Tesla was almost none existence phantom loss. I didn’t think I had to go through all this S… to keep the battery healthy. Any tips in addition to what has been mentioned on this thread to make charging LVB less frequent while keeping it at high SOC is appreciated.

 

[Jim Lewis]

I'm confused. You tried charging on Accessories Mode? That's not a thing. To charge the LVB, you either start the truck (and turn off HVAC and headlights), turn off the shutdown timer, and lock it for a while, or drive it. Accessories mode will use the LVB.

Hi, Rick. You've forgotten. You brought the same issue up in a different thread a while back, and I pointed out then that it's perfectly possible to charge the LVB in Accessory Mode if the truck is plugged into a charger. In the post of mine in this thread to which @Maxx is referring, I describe being plugged in and LED action at the charging port as the LVB is being charged (presumably from my HVB, which seems to be charged to replenish itself while plugged in in Accessory Mode). Our confusion on these things is because Ford, AFAIK, doesn't have a clear advanced user/pro description of how things work readily accessible. Things are just supposed to work for us and we're not supposed to worry our silly little brains as to what's going on behind the scenes...

See our posts prior to this one: https://www.f150lightningforum.com/forum/threads/top-battery-off-to-90-every-day.17738/post-357882

 

[RickLightning]

Got it. Per a another post in thread I see that it is on the homepage of the dashboard as SOC, which I thought was the HVB. Even with the tender I am at 92%...

It will take days to get to 99 or 100%.

 

[Jim Lewis]

Even with the tender I am at 92%...

(edit: wrong insert previously! )

I tried a 1.25 A Battery Tender and a 2 A Noco 2 tender. Whether using the jump points or the + terminal on the battery and the attachment point below the BSM, I could never tend above 80% SOC, even with the AGM charging setting on the Noco 2. Being ignorant about truck electronics, I wondered if my predicament related to the initial problematic BSM that's now being replaced. Running the truck in Accessory Mode while plugged into my FCSP, I can easily charge into the 90th percentile. Any advice on why I could never tend over 80% LVB SOC is welcomed!

I don't like the idea of having to tend because when my truck is parked in my garage, it's within inches of the garage end wall, the most convenient wall plug is on the other side of the truck (hard to get to with the garage door closed), and I don't want to be driving around with the tender clips on the battery itself and the terminal covers removed or have to engineer a similar solution for the jump points and have the tender and its wires taking up space in my frunk, if not flopping around while I drive, etc.

Ford ought to engineer a solution where the HVB can more readily tend the LVB if the owner desires to expend the truck's resources that way and has no daily range worries based on decreased HVB SOC. Even an iPhone gives you full power/low power option settings. The trouble with the Battery Management System and the Battery Monitor Sensor is, again, we don't get as much info as even an iPhone or Android phone gives you. We get some gross graph of where HVB energy went on a short-term basis for a single trip, but on an iPhone or Android phone, you can see what energy individual apps used in the last 24 hours, the last 10 days, etc.

 

[RickLightning]

Hi, Rick. You've forgotten. You brought the same issue up in a different thread a while back, and I pointed out then that it's perfectly possible to charge the LVB in Accessory Mode if the truck is plugged into a charger. In the post of mine in this thread to which @Maxx is referring, I describe being plugged in and LED action at the charging port as the LVB is being charged (presumably from my HVB, which seems to be charged to replenish itself while plugged in in Accessory Mode). Our confusion on these things is because Ford, AFAIK, doesn't have a clear advanced user/pro description of how things work readily accessible. Things are just supposed to work for us and we're not supposed to worry our silly little brains as to what's going on behind the scenes...

See our posts prior to this one: https://www.f150lightningforum.com/forum/threads/top-battery-off-to-90-every-day.17738/post-357882

I was traveling when you did that post, and did not remember it.

When @Maxx posted in this thread that he was charging the LVB while in Accessory Mode, I made the same conclusion I did when you posted your thread, that the truck was not plugged in. I took it that he was in Accessory mode thinking that would charge the LVB after reducing it. Made no sense to me.

Besides using a Battery Tender (which will take days to get to 100%), another way to keep your 12v charged is to charge the truck with the 120v pigtail of the Ford Mobile Charger. Since the LVB charges whenever the vehicle is actively charging, that drawn out and inefficient HVB charging process actually gets the LVB to 100%. Probably much more wasted energy that a Battery Tender though.

 

[Maxx]

Our confusion on these things is because Ford, AFAIK, doesn't have a clear advanced user/pro description of how things work readily accessible. Things are just supposed to work for us and we're not supposed to worry our silly little brains as to what's going on behind the scenes...

We need a YouTube video of an engineer showing with animation how electrons flow under all conditions from where to where and an interface showing it with numbers and corresponding graphics on truck display. A more comprehensive and intuitive version of what Ford has already tried to do.

Edit: And a live heat map of the system too.

 

[Jim Lewis]

Since the LVB charges whenever the vehicle is actively charging, that drawn out and inefficient HVB charging process actually gets the LVB to 100%.

Interesting idea. I probably drive so little and charge my HVB so little that I'd have a hard time keeping my LVB charged via either my FCSP or Mobile Charger. I'm the classic case for a tender - not driving enough. But in an EV, why have to get a tender? Ford already seems to use a gentle charging rate, especially above 80% LVB SOC. And Ford letting the LVB SOC go to 30% before mandating recharge from the HVB doesn't seem good for long-term LVB lifespan. Even though AGM batteries are more tolerant of deep discharge than classic lead acid batteries, they're not immune. I've seen 50% SOC as the recommended trigger point for AGM recharges. I'll try to keep mine above 70% SOC, which I think is the recommended recharge point for classic lead acid.

 

[RickLightning]

Interesting idea. I probably drive so little and charge my HVB so little that I'd have a hard time keeping my LVB charged via either my FCSP or Mobile Charger. I'm the classic case for a tender - not driving enough. But in an EV, why have to get a tender? Ford already seems to use a gentle charging rate, especially above 80% LVB SOC. And Ford letting the LVB SOC go to 30% before mandating recharge from the HVB doesn't seem good for long-term LVB lifespan. Even though AGM batteries are more tolerant of deep discharge than classic lead acid batteries, they're not immune. I've seen 50% SOC as the recommended trigger point for AGM recharges. I'll try to keep mine above 70% SOC, which I think is the recommended recharge point for classic lead acid.

I saw this clearly when, reading your December post, I was charging at my son's at 120v for days (Mach-E).

My 2013 F-150 gave the Battery Low message in 2014. Service Manager said drive it or Battery Tender. After putting it on the BT, never got the message again until the battery wore out in year 8, didn't fail ever.

I put the Mach-E on it when the updates were flowing several per week, but our normal use SHOULD keep it fine.

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