Tesla Fire!!

[WileyKyle]

I stopped at the Mechanicsburg, PA Sheetz to charge at the Tesla supercharger. When I arrived I found the aftermath of a recent Tesla fire. Employee said it was burning for hours. Half the chargers were closed but I was able to charge successfully on one of the remaining chargers

 

[Scorpio3d]

https://hbg100.com/2024/07/09/hazma...arging-station-in-mechanicsburg-pennsylvania/

 

[Maxx]

You could have been charging there if you got there earlier.

As lightning munches on electrons while looking at remains of another EV, this image makes me think EVs are more like mice than they are like birds.

"Early bird gets the worm but the second mouse gets the cheese"

 

[ryun]

I know these fires are rare, and they may be just as rare as fires at a gas station for all I know. But, boy, does seeing stories like this make me real uncomfortable walking out of sight of my EVs when they're DCFC.

 

[RickLightning]

I know these fires are rare, and they may be just as rare as fires at a gas station for all I know. But, boy, does seeing stories like this make me real uncomfortable walking out of sight of my EVs when they're DCFC.

They are MORE RARE than fires in gas vehicles. Much more rare.

 

[Danface]

It'll be interesting to find out the root cause.

 

[TheBigBezo]

They are MORE RARE than fires in gas vehicles. Much more rare.

This reminds me of when I almost got stranded in Baton Rouge back in April. I was venting to my mother since I had planned on getting into our hometown to join them for dinner but I was stuck trying to figure out a solution as to why my adapter seemingly stopped working. As I was driving to another charger I saw a ICE car completely engulfed in fire on the side of the highway. I joked with her that hopefully my frustration that say wouldn't dissuade her from EVs considering the poor guy I just passed was clearly having a much WORSE day than me!

 

[Danface]

https://hbg100.com/2024/07/09/hazma...arging-station-in-mechanicsburg-pennsylvania/

The story just below it on the same page ...

https://hbg100.com/2024/07/07/truck-hit-gas-pump-at-redners-market-in-palmyra-pennsylvania/

 

[Ffxdude]

Looks like a Y went up as well…

https://hbg100.com/2024/05/21/fire-at-hersheys-chocolate-world-leaves-letter-y-melted-on-sign/

This was a great location for me, en route to the poconos. Hope it’s fully operational again soon.

 

[Scorpio3d]

The story just below it on the same page ...

https://hbg100.com/2024/07/07/truck-hit-gas-pump-at-redners-market-in-palmyra-pennsylvania/

Looks like that truck hit the pump square sideways?? Texting and driving?

 

[chl]

They are MORE RARE than fires in gas vehicles. Much more rare.

Yes, perhaps as much as 100 times rarer apparently:

Although EV fires may be tougher to put out, they’re comparatively rare, he said.

“I’ve read that an internal-combustion engine has a risk of fire of somewhere around 0.1% of likelihood, whereas these EVs run 0.001%,” Johnson said. “It’s significantly less risk. I’ve seen reports of significant fires or multiple fires in electric vehicles, so it was surprising to see how much safer they are in terms of likelihood of fire.”

https://red.msudenver.edu/2024/though-rare-fires-in-electric-vehicles-pose-serious-risks/
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The internal link:
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"...Our intial research findings, based on global EV battery fires from 2010-2020, indicate a 0.0012% of a passenger electric vehicle battery catching fire.

While it's difficult to find a similar stat for internal combustion engine (ICE) passenger vehicles globally, a range of country-based reports we found suggest there is a 0.1% chance of an ICE vehicle catching fire.

In this FAQ list, there is additional evidence from other sources to suggest EVs are less likely to catch fire than ICE cars...."
...
"From 2012 to 2020, there has been approximately one Tesla vehicle fire for every 205 million miles traveled. By comparison, data from the National Fire Protection Association (NFPA) and U.S. Department of Transportation show that in the U.S. there is one vehicle fire for every 19 million miles traveled."
...
"Hybrid vehicles actually come in number one with the most fires per 100K sales. Gas vehicles are second, and electric vehicles place third, with only 25 fires per 100K electric vehicle sales. Based on this data, electric vehicles don’t catch fire nearly as much as the news claims. Hybrid cars seem to be the most dangerous for fires, followed by gas vehicles."
...

There are two important points to note here:

EV fires don't necessarily involve the lithium ion traction battery Of the EV fires we've studied, not all involved the traction battery; ie. the vehicle body was the only thing on fire. These incidents are treated like any other vehicle fire (but care should be taken with towing & storage). It's important to note that some online sources are quoting figures that include ALL electric vehicle fires, rather than just those involving the traction battery, which artificially inflates the number of incidents overall. As an example, the Instituut Fysieke Veiligheid (Institute for Safety) in The Netherlands reports 77 in the first 6 months of 2021. However, they point out that only 6 of these involved a traction battery fire. We have NOT included these incidents in our project data.

Not all EV traction battery fires start within the vehicle itself 4% of the EV traction battery fires we studied were caused by a fire that started externally to the vehicle; it was parked in a building that caught fire or near internal combustion vehicles that caught fire. We HAVE included these incidents in our project data as the traction battery was involved & managed by emergency responders.

https://www.evfiresafe.com/ev-fire-faqs
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A 12v battery can cause a fire when wiring shorts out. There have been some fires like this due to bad ignition switches in some makes, including Fords:

On April 25, 1996, Ford Motor Company announced it would conduct one of the largest recalls for a safety-related defect in the history of the U.S. Department of Transportation. The recall covered approximately 7,900,000 Ford, Lincoln, and Mercury vehicles in the U.S. from model year 1988 through 1993 for a defect in the ignition switch causing the cars to catch ablaze spontaneously (NHTSA recall number 96V-071).

https://www.autosafety.org/ford-ignition-switch-fires/

Or a leaking gas line in a Ford:

Ford is recalling nearly 43,000 small SUVs because gasoline can leak from the fuel injectors onto hot engine surfaces, increasing the risk of fires. But the recall remedy does not include repairing the fuel leaks.

The recall covers certain Bronco Sport SUVs from the 2022 and 2023 model years, as well as Escape SUVs from 2022. All have 1.5-liter engines.

Ford says in documents filed with U.S. safety regulators that fuel injectors can crack, and gasoline or vapor can accumulate near ignition sources, possibly touching off fires.

https://www.carriermanagement.com/news/2024/04/12/261089.htm

Fast DC charging stations are probably more prone to HV battery fires because of the stress they put on the battery, especially if the battery is already hot from a long drive in a hot environment (there is only so much active battery cooling can do, after all) and things do break down from time to time, coolant leaks or evaporates, and Li batteries could have hidden manufacturing flaws that result in a thermal runaway when stressed, etc.

The Fire Risk

• Numerous lithium-ion battery fires occur during the charging process due to overheating caused by defects in the battery or its management system.
• The substantial Battery Energy Storage System (BESS) in electric vehicles poses a noteworthy fire risk that warrants attention.
• Any fire incident at an EV charging station has the potential to extend to the connected vehicle.
• The local fire service is often unaware and inexperienced with the fire and explosion hazards of Electric Vehicles, EV Charging Stations and ESS

https://www.statx.com/application/fire-suppression-electric-vehicle-charging-stations/

In the event of a HV battery fire, one would hope the vehicle has adequate fire barriers although
as some have noted "[C]urrent thermal management solutions often rely on thick, dense, and brittle fire barriers, adding weight, cost, and complexity to EV designs. To address this challenge effectively, industry and academia must collaborate to pioneer innovative solutions that enhance safety without compromising performance" with lightweight solutions.

https://www.halo.science/research/m...-activated-fire-barrier-for-ev-aluminum-parts

In the meantime, if I ever DC fast charge my Lightning, I'd like to keep a safe distance from other charging vehicles if possible. Those Lightnings that burned up at a Ford charging station in Feb of 2023 before being shipped to dealers sure was an eye-opener.

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/04/20/f-150-lightning-fire-footage-growing-ev-risk.html

Quality control and on-board safeguards are paramount for all vehicles, ICE or EV.

Before anyone gets the wrong idea, I am not being an alarmist or an EV hater, I have been driving a 2012 Nissan Leaf since Dec 2011, and charge it in my attached garage (30A L2) without incident.

But I did decide to charge my Lightning in the driveway, both because of the Feb 2023 Ford Lightning incident indicating the possibility of serious defects in the batteries, and because it is a too tight fit.

 

[RickLightning]

In the Ford fire ONE vehicle caught fire, which then caught others. It was due to a short circuit, unrelated to charging. It caught other vehicles.

18 vehicles were recalled. SK On had a manufacturing issue.

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/04/20/f-150-lightning-fire-footage-growing-ev-risk.html#:~:text=An electric Ford F-150,of Ford's in Dearborn, Michigan.

I get charging in the driveway if you cannot fit in the garage, but for battery fire risk it's simply not an issue.

 

[Texas Dan]

I spent all week traveling around Austin and San Antonio last week. I saw three ICE fires, all right on the freeway. I have never seen an EV fire but of course there are a lot more ICEs.

ICEs are inherently prone to catch on fire when they get older. Many older ICEs don’t get maintained well and leaking gas and oil catches on fire when it hits the hot exhaust manifolds. I can’t imagine an EV catching on fire like that just because it’s old and poorly maintained unless it’s damaged or has a design flaw.

 

[beast]

I stopped at the Mechanicsburg, PA Sheetz to charge at the Tesla supercharger. When I arrived I found the aftermath of a recent Tesla fire. Employee said it was burning for hours. Half the chargers were closed but I was able to charge successfully on one of the remaining chargers

This sucks I have a trip coming up soon up that way

 

[Maxx]

I wonder if we are going to see more fireworks at superchargers after Elon fired the whole team.

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