GM To Adopt Tesla/NACS Charging Standard

[greenne]

That’s great, but we will end up with the same problems if these fools don’t start realizing that it isn’t about only what conector is being used smh….

What’s the point if they all change but we still show up with stations down or giving us errors, etc etc. At least myself I am excited because we will be able to use Tesla SC not because the connector is changing….that’s just me

Frankly for us it would be be better if they improved on the current CCS experience, I don’t want to use an adaptor all the time

On the contrary, a lot of current EV owners are going to realize its a pain to use an adaptor every time they want to plug into their existing EVSE at home.

TBH, I'd rather use an adaptor the very few times I travel to use NACS(if needed) vs having to use a j1772 -->Tesla adaptor every night at home.

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[Zprime29]

Just leave the adaptor on the plug? Not terribly unlike needing to plug our USB cables into a wall adapter. We usually have one or two dedicated outlets that just have the "wall warts" in them all the time for charging. I imagine, if I where to sell and upgrade to a newer vehicle that uses NACS, I'd just slap the adapter on my J1772 charger and leave it there. At worst, I'd need a new solution for a holster but half the time when rolling up the cable for my FCSP I end up just letting it dangle downwards.

Now, if I where to end up getting a second EV and now have one with CCS and one with NACS, then that might be annoying. Sharing one EVSE is 100% viable and it would be nice to save a few $$$ and not buy a second. I don't hear too much complaining from folk here that have a Tesla and a Ford. Am I misreading that? Does everyone who has two different EV's have both types of EVSE's? Hmmm....might be a good poll.

 

[Pioneer74]

On the contrary, a lot of current EV owners are going to realize its a pain to use an adaptor every time they want to plug into their existing EVSE at home.

TBH, I'd rather use an adaptor the very few times I travel to use NACS(if needed) vs having to use a j1772 -->Tesla adaptor every night at home.

Makes you wonder if EVSE manufacturers would be open to selling NACS replacement cables. When the time comes, I'd gladly swap the cable out on my Emporia if they offered it.

 

[greenne]

Makes you wonder if EVSE manufacturers would be open to selling NACS replacement cables. When the time comes, I'd gladly swap the cable out on my Emporia if they offered it.

It makes sense that they would want to do that. I also envision a future where EA/EvGO/Chargepoint offer BOTH a CCS(j1772) and an NACS cable at their station for awhile. That makes sense business wise.

Although I do think we will all eventually transition to NACS, I think that will take awhile. There will millions of CCS equipped EVs on the road for several years to come.

(Just like its taken many years to evolve from CHadEmo to CCS, it will take more to go from CCS to NACS)

 

[davehu]

That’s great, but we will end up with the same problems if these fools don’t start realizing that it isn’t about only what conector is being used smh….

What’s the point if they all change but we still show up with stations down or giving us errors, etc etc. At least myself I am excited because we will be able to use Tesla SC not because the connector is changing….that’s just me

Frankly for us it would be be better if they improved on the current CCS experience, I don’t want to use an adaptor all the time

true, but until now EA's (for example) competition was chargepoint, blink, etc. they only had to be better than the competition to grow and retain customers. Now their competition for our charging dollars is Tesla. Step up or go out of business.

 

[Texas Dan]

Honestly--

EA could have Tesla(NACS) connections at most of their stations and they would still have 95% or more of the same problems. The problem is primarily hardware/software issues (along with crappy customer service) that will not be solved by a new connector.

Tesla only has a 74% satisfactory rating compared to EA’s 63% satisfactory rating. Quit putting all the blame on EA. Tesla has plenty of room for improvement and the situation is just going get worse for Tesla when all EVs can use Superchargers.

 

[greenne]

Tesla only has a 74% satisfactory rating compared to EA’s 63% satisfactory rating. Quit putting all the blame on EA. Tesla has plenty of room for improvement and the situation is just going get worse for Tesla when all EVs can use Superchargers.

FWIW The only time I've used EA there were issues, but got the job done. EvGO (with the CCS connector) has been flawless. As an added bonus, EvGO is significantly cheaper than Tesla or EA per kWH. Some states along the East Coast charge per minute which means it ends up being much, much cheaper on EvGO.

I have no experience with Tesla, but EA does not get a pass here. Their customer support has been clueless, operational control has been sloppy. For example..who the F in their right mind takes down a network for "upgrades" on busy holiday weekend travel. Who in their right mind takes down several stations in a row along busy interstate corridors with no thought as to how it will effect customers who depend on those stations. Also, why is it that EA consistently has bad/outdated information on their website/phone app..and when you call they have NO idea of the operational status of their own equipment. I didn't mean to get into EA bashing.. but they lack command and control.

All this said-- if there is a reasonable option for NACS(or even CCS) charging that is NOT a Tesla supercharger location I will use it. For personal reasons I prefer not to give Elon my business. I fully acknowledge the supercharger network as "better" in terms of availability and reliability, but if given the choice I prefer something different.

 

[Amps]

Tesla only has a 74% satisfactory rating

I wonder if part of that dissatisfaction is a Yogi Berra-type problem?

Paraphrased, "Nobody likes the place because it's too crowded"

 

[F150ROD]

Tesla only has a 74% satisfactory rating compared to EA’s 63% satisfactory rating. Quit putting all the blame on EA. Tesla has plenty of room for improvement and the situation is just going get worse for Tesla when all EVs can use Superchargers.

Damn really?!!! Never had an issue with Tesla …..

 

[Zprime29]

Tesla only has a 74% satisfactory rating compared to EA’s 63% satisfactory rating. Quit putting all the blame on EA. Tesla has plenty of room for improvement and the situation is just going get worse for Tesla when all EVs can use Superchargers.

Real world data, check ins from folks like us on Rate Your Charge on twitter. Notice who consistently scores high? What is the definition of satisfaction...what factors go into it? Here's how RYC categorizes check ins:

Good check-in: Requires all the following:

• A successful charge
• An accurate smartphone app
• Full charging speeds on first plug in
• More than 50% of chargers on site working at full speed

Bad check-in: Users were still able to charge their vehicles, but their experience was not up to our standards. Check-ins are classified as bad if the charge was successful but the user experienced at least one of the following:

• Faulty/incorrect smartphone app
• Charging speeds limited by the charger
• Needing to re-plug in for any reason
• Calling customer support
• 50% or more chargers at site are limited or down
• 5 or more minutes waiting at a full site

And the results:

This tells me, regardless of how satisfied I am (which honestly, satisfaction is a very subjective measurement), Tesla is the most reliable by a pretty good margin when compared to EA. Sure, there's another 9% Tesla can improve, but the more impactful improvement would be with EA. That's why we keep talking about it.

Source: https://mailchi.mp/34f7182a1e1a/rate-your-charge-242023-12610012

 

[vandy1981]

Real world data, check ins from folks like us on Rate Your Charge on twitter. Notice who consistently scores high? What is the definition of satisfaction...what factors go into it? Here's how RYC categorizes check ins:

And the results:

This tells me, regardless of how satisfied I am (which honestly, satisfaction is a very subjective measurement), Tesla is the most reliable by a pretty good margin when compared to EA. Sure, there's another 9% Tesla can improve, but the more impactful improvement would be with EA. That's why we keep talking about it.

I'm not challenging the qualitative conclusions they make about relative reliability of EA vs Tesla SC, but this chart is based on a relatively small sample size that is prone to selection bias. It's better than when they started and were making broad statements based on 40 check ins, though. This chart shows the total number of check ins last week--you can't really make conclusions about CP or EVGo given the low number of checkins.

 

[Zprime29]

That's why I specifically said Tesla compared to EA. Sorry, I should have mentioned that the others where essentially noise. The monthly report for May has a similar story:

 

[GDN]

Just leave the adaptor on the plug? Not terribly unlike needing to plug our USB cables into a wall adapter. We usually have one or two dedicated outlets that just have the "wall warts" in them all the time for charging. I imagine, if I where to sell and upgrade to a newer vehicle that uses NACS, I'd just slap the adapter on my J1772 charger and leave it there. At worst, I'd need a new solution for a holster but half the time when rolling up the cable for my FCSP I end up just letting it dangle downwards.

Now, if I where to end up getting a second EV and now have one with CCS and one with NACS, then that might be annoying. Sharing one EVSE is 100% viable and it would be nice to save a few $$$ and not buy a second. I don't hear too much complaining from folk here that have a Tesla and a Ford. Am I misreading that? Does everyone who has two different EV's have both types of EVSE's? Hmmm....might be a good poll.

I've got both variations in the garage - the Lightning and a Y. (previously 2 model 3's). Prepandemic both 3's charged several times a week, and daily during the winter so I have a 14-50 plug for one and a Tesla Wall Charger for the other. Used them both at the same time.

Fast Forward, now a Y and a Lightning and I now work form home. We charge each of them about once a week. I share the Wall charger and put a Tesla tap adapter on it for the truck. The adapter can be a small pain, but it affords me the ability to leave the portable charger in each of the vehicles so if we were to ever travel we don't have to remember loading it up.

If we were to a point I needed to charge 3 or more times a week with either I'd plug one of the portables back into the 14-50 and have a dedicated charger for each.

 

[GDN]

I hear and understand that EA must be pretty good in some parts of the country, but I don't need polls to tell me what my 6 years of experience has been. I'd put my Tesla experience judging ease of usage, availability of chargers, working on the first plug for 5 years at about 98% and for EA and Francis chargers in North Texas and OK, about 65%.

I've never been stranded, but from probably 12 charging experiences only twice have I not had to plug in 3 or more times to find a charger that works and never once have I even gotten the 150kW out of one of them for the truck.

There is no comparison between the two.

Also agree with a few previous posters, this is about having access to the Tesla network. Putting a different color lipstick on a pig doesn't make it any more attractive ie - adding a NACS cable to a charger or a network that doesn't already work does nothing for me other than get "Tesla" a bad name, because most will just start reporting a NACS/Tesla charger didn't work, when they really will mean a NACS cable at another brand of charger didn't work.

For a little drama this was my charging experience on the way home Sunday - employee of the gas station blocked charger number 4. I tried, 1, 2 and 3 and failed on all of them before doing what I did, but this was easier than going in to find someone to move a car.

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