If a Tesla can recognize all versions of supercharger, why can’t Lightning be programmed to do the same?

[PrimeRisk]

I’m not saying they don’t work. I’m just saying I won’t give a penny to that company. I’m not even turned off at Elon. Could care less about him.

my issue is Tesla fans buys and how majority of the customers have a superiority complex.

I still remember walking into a Tesla store in 2014 with my wife and kids to buy a Tesla, they were the only electric car at the time in eugene Oregon and since I was wearing pajamas the sale person thought I could not afford a Tesla. They lost me that day. F Tesla

I’ll go get a snickers now

Yeah, Tesla's sales-weasels can be the worst. When the Model S Plaid rolled out I got to see the first one in a showroom at the Cherry Creek Mall Location in Denver, CO. It's the ritzy mall in town. The only reason we were in the mall is because my wife's "thing" is purses, she wanted a Louis Vuitton and that's where the only one in Denver-Metro is located.

On the way in we passed the Tesla showroom and there was a group of people crawling all over the Plaid with all doors, hood, and hatchback open. An hour later, my wife has her new purse and we're heading back through the mall. The Tesla showroom is empty of customers, so we duck in.

The Plaid is all closed up and locked. The sales-weasel, Chad, approaches us but doesn't say anything. I asked Chad to look inside and he said that it was the only one they had and they weren't opening it up. I said that's funny, when we walked by an hour ago there was a group of people all over it and in it. He said, well I'm not opening it now. So we walked out.

My wife and I were not wearing pajamas, nor were we wearing Prada. I don't remember exactly, but I was likely wearing Carhartt jeans and some polo from a golf tournament. I was wearing my 1965 Gilt Submariner, though Chad probably thought it was a Timex.

All the above said, it was Chad that was a dipsh!t, not Tesla. We own 2 and will buy another if/when they wear out. I will also go charge my vehicles where it takes the least time & frustration. I could care less about a few cents per kWh.

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[RocketGhost]

https://www.ford.com/support/how-to...lic-charging/how-to-find-tesla-superchargers/

Black collar on the charger handle, compatible. Silver collar, incompatible. Whatever the difference is, it isn't just software.

For Fords it's likely not a matter of software in the truck or they would at least be working on it. It's got to be hardware related.

 

[Scorpio3d]

If all the other auto makers are adopting the NACS adapter in the next few years, then I think they must have figured it out by now??
I don’t particularly like the egomaniac, but the technology of the superchargers seems to be far superior to the other options available(at least as far as not being down all the time) I know there were many many people involved in creating Tesla he is just the front man.

 

[MichaelCA]

If all the other auto makers are adopting the NACS adapter in the next few years, then I think they must have figured it out by now??
I don’t particularly like the egomaniac, but the technology of the superchargers seems to be far superior to the other options available(at least as far as not being down all the time) I know there were many many people involved in creating Tesla he is just the front man.

if you look at Tesla or SpaceX products overall, theyre optimized to extreme levels. Examples include Tesla Supermanifold and look at pictures of their frunk area. Tightly packed and tesla designed and manfactured(or subcontracted) components. legacy Oem take off the shelf parts and make do with them and therefore uoptimized spacing and they also have seperate computers from difference manufacturers controlling each part. Tesla and now Rivian, utilize only a dozen or fewer to computers to control everything. Ex: Ford said Mach-e had 1.6km of extra wiring.

In terms of spacex: heres a clear example:

the ULA CEO didnt even believe that Raptor 3 was that clean and claimed that it was missing hardware(it wasnt.) https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GUfxxsQW8AAmnpf?format=jpg&name=large

Also heres a pic of v3 vs EA supercharger insides:

This is what I think anyway not an expert, just regurgigating what I hear people say.

 

[RickLightning]

The problem with that is that the Tesla superchargers always work. I own Teslas also and I've never had a problem charging away from home, not once. The absolute worst thing about owning a Lightning is dealing with Electrify America chargers.

Hogwash.

We have charged at 4 Tesla Supercharger locations, one a half dozen times. Onee of the locations had 2 dead chargers. A week later it still did.

Yes, the location works, but 25% were dead for at least a week.

 

[Firn]

Agreed, but all of that could be solved with some money (software and hardware in the truck) but none of it is an unsolvable technical issue.

Ford implemented the NACS standard, what you speak of is not NACS.

 

[sotek2345]

Ford implemented the NACS standard, what you speak of is not NACS.

I didn't say it was, I said it was a solvable technical problem. The issue isn't an engineering one.

 

[Firn]

I didn't say it was, I said it was a solvable technical problem. The issue isn't an engineering one.

Again, Ford implemented NACS. They didn't ask tesla to use the Superchargers, they implemented NACS.

 

[PrimeRisk]

Hogwash.

We have charged at 4 Tesla Supercharger locations, one a half dozen times. Onee of the locations had 2 dead chargers. A week later it still did.

Yes, the location works, but 25% were dead for at least a week.

I was speaking to the site and the ability to charge every time, not every stall every time being in service. I have driven from Denver, CO to the West Coast, Gulf Coast, and the Upper Peninsula and have visited 50+ Tesla Supercharger locations in my travels, never once a problem of any sort to immediately pull in, plug in, and walk away. Never a comms issue, never a initiation issue, and never had to call customer service to get a charger authorized.

Tesla has their proverbial sh!t together for consistent and reliable OTR charging. No one else in the the United States does.

 

[PrimeRisk]

Again, Ford implemented NACS. They didn't ask tesla to use the Superchargers, they implemented NACS.

Actually they did have to ask Tesla and enter into agreements to use the Superchargers.

To date, Tesla only allows Fords and Rivians to charge at their Superchargers and as you can see from this thread, not every Supercharger location is open to Non-Tesla vehicles. The debate is whether that is purely a technical limitation or if Tesla intentionally reserves some of their sites in highly congested areas so Tesla owners do not have to compete with other brands for availability.

https://www.tesla.com/support/supercharging-other-evs

 

[RickLightning]

I was speaking to the site and the ability to charge every time, not every stall every time being in service. I have driven from Denver, CO to the West Coast, Gulf Coast, and the Upper Peninsula and have visited 50+ Tesla Supercharger locations in my travels, never once a problem of any sort to immediately pull in, plug in, and walk away. Never a comms issue, never a initiation issue, and never had to call customer service to get a charger authorized.

Tesla has their proverbial sh!t together for consistent and reliable OTR charging. No one else in the the United States does.

Understand.

As I and others have posted, we have tried to pull in and charge at Tesla locations where Tesla owners park in every other space (based on learnings from V1 / V2 locations that are no longer applicable), and couldn't charge, because we have to use the charger on the left that they are using. So we had to wait. That was our first Tesla experience, wait was about 15 min, had to stop Tesla owners from pulling into the empty spaces while I waited, then I finally started asking drivers how close to done they were, found a woman at 94% and going to 100% and sat next to her.

 

[PrimeRisk]

Understand.

As I and others have posted, we have tried to pull in and charge at Tesla locations where Tesla owners park in every other space (based on learnings from V1 / V2 locations that are no longer applicable), and couldn't charge, because we have to use the charger on the left that they are using. So we had to wait. That was our first Tesla experience, wait was about 15 min, had to stop Tesla owners from pulling into the empty spaces while I waited, then I finally started asking drivers how close to done they were, found a woman at 94% and going to 100% and sat next to her.

Yes, they physical connectivity issue will be around for quite awhile, especially at congested locations. I've seen some creative solutions such as parking behind the stalls to get close enough. I'm not sure what the best solution will be to resolve this for the 60,000 existing supercharger stalls, but I'm sure that a few years from now this will all be an issue we look back at and laugh.

I am hoping that other manufacturers take the opportunity to implement the NACS technology so Tesla does not end up a de facto monopoly for charging. Competition is good for the consumer.

 

[RocketGhost]

The debate is whether that is purely a technical limitation or if Tesla intentionally reserves some of their sites in highly congested areas so Tesla owners do not have to compete with other brands for availability.

According to the Ford webpage I linked above, if the Supercharger has a black ring, it's compatible, and if it has a silver ring, it's incompatible. Unless Tesla goes and changes the color on the handles for the ones it wants to reserve for only Teslas, I'd say that rumor is false.

However, that doesn't mean they intentionally aren't upgrading older chargers to keep them Tesla-only. That's the only way they'd be "reserving" chargers only for them. But it's clearly not a situation where people at Tesla go down the list of their stations and check yes/no to allow other makes to charge there based on congestion.

 

[PrimeRisk]

if you look at Tesla or SpaceX products overall, theyre optimized to extreme levels. Examples include Tesla Supermanifold and look at pictures of their frunk area. Tightly packed and tesla designed and manfactured(or subcontracted) components. legacy Oem take off the shelf parts and make do with them and therefore uoptimized spacing and they also have seperate computers from difference manufacturers controlling each part. Tesla and now Rivian, utilize only a dozen or fewer to computers to control everything. Ex: Ford said Mach-e had 1.6km of extra wiring.

In terms of spacex: heres a clear example:

the ULA CEO didnt even believe that Raptor 3 was that clean and claimed that it was missing hardware(it wasnt.) https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GUfxxsQW8AAmnpf?format=jpg&name=large

Also heres a pic of v3 vs EA supercharger insides:

This is what I think anyway not an expert, just regurgigating what I hear people say.

Thank you for sharing. These are very stark examples of simplification of design that has hopefully lead to reduced space, weight, complexity, build costs and maintenance costs. I had to open up my 2015 JuiceBox Pro that was out of warranty and malfunctioning to apply a firmware update directly. I was amazed that the huge wall mounted box was 90% empty air. Nothing but a 2"x2" power supply board and a 2"x6" logic board running a dual-pole relay.

 

[Shawnson]

Simplistic question, I know, and yes, I have used the search button on the forum. But at a very simple level, if a Tesla can differentiate between the different types of superchargers, and adapt to different protocol or handshake to recognize and accept a charge from them, Then, what is the limiting step for the lightning to be able to do the same? I would love access to all or more superchargers if I buy a Ford EV (virtually all the ones around me are level 2 and not accessible. )
Engineers be nice to me, I studied biochemistry and don’t remember much of that either.

Older Superchargers use a proprietary communication method. Something is missing there to support CCS as original Teslas needed a charging port update (wasn’t just an OTA) to support CCS charging. So there’s likely hardware involved too with the original spec.

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