Strange charging estimation to full charge on L2 - 36 hours instead of 4 hours normally ?

[metroshot]

Just out of curiosity, how does the truck know the output of the EVSE for the calculations. If I were to upgrade my unit would I have to edit a setting?

The truck does not know the output of the charger.
My charger app tells me what rate it's putting out.

Truck takes in as much as the on board inverters can handle.
SR max is 11kW
ER max is 19.2kW

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[Maquis]

The truck does not know the output of the charger.
My charger app tells me what rate it's putting out.

Truck takes in as much as the on board inverters can handle.
SR max is 11kW
ER max is 19.2kW

Not exactly. The EVSE pilot signal tells the truck what it’s capable of. In that sense, the truck does know the (possible) output of the EVSE. The truck’s charger will set the charge rate not to exceed the EVSE capability. The set rate could be lower than the EVSE maximum, but never more.

 

[jimfigler]

The truck does not know the output of the charger.
My charger app tells me what rate it's putting out.

Truck takes in as much as the on board inverters can handle.
SR max is 11kW
ER max is 19.2kW

I don't have a charger app. But I do know my charger is using 7.7 kw every hour from Emporia app.

 

[tls]

Not exactly. The EVSE pilot signal tells the truck what it’s capable of. In that sense, the truck does know the (possible) output of the EVSE. The truck’s charger will set the charge rate not to exceed the EVSE capability. The set rate could be lower than the EVSE maximum, but never more.

The truck definitely does know the actual output of the charger as negotiated with the truck - look at your FordPass app - but appears to actually report it by telematics (and calculate the expected charge complete time) only once per session (again, look at your FordPass app). This results in truly wiggy reporting at low temperatures, like the app reporting 1kW charge rate during a session that is obviously running at ten times that (as you can see from the total kW delivered, in your FordPass app).

Once again we see how the app is the absolute worst thing about this truck.

 

[Maquis]

The truck definitely does know the actual output of the charger as negotiated with the truck - look at your FordPass app - but appears to actually report it by telematics (and calculate the expected charge complete time) only once per session (again, look at your FordPass app). This results in truly wiggy reporting at low temperatures, like the app reporting 1kW charge rate during a session that is obviously running at ten times that (as you can see from the total kW delivered, in your FordPass app).

Once again we see how the app is the absolute worst thing about this truck.

You need to read the J1772 protocol spec.

 

[tls]

You need to read the J1772 protocol spec.

Why? Because I used the word "negotiate" when the actual current limiting is being enforced entirely by the onboard charger? Sure, that's not exactly what happens; but, at the end of the day, in a charge session that runs at rate R for 10 minutes and 10R for the next 10 hours, our truck's telematics report the charge rate as R for the entire time (or maybe the crummy app throws away data and mis-renders what's left).

In any event, the rate displayed in the app, as well as the expected finish time, are routinely entirely wrong - and contradicted by other data also displayed in the app on the same screen. @Ford Motor Company could fix this - no other EV manufacturer's app has bugs of this kind, much less ones that persist for literally years - but seems to not understand how exasperating it is to customers.

 

[Maquis]

Why? Because I used the word "negotiate" when the actual current limiting is being enforced entirely by the onboard charger? Sure, that's not exactly what happens; but, at the end of the day, in a charge session that runs at rate R for 10 minutes and 10R for the next 10 hours, our truck's telematics report the charge rate as R for the entire time (or maybe the crummy app throws away data and mis-renders what's left).

In any event, the rate displayed in the app, as well as the expected finish time, are routinely entirely wrong - and contradicted by other data also displayed in the app on the same screen. @Ford Motor Company could fix this - no other EV manufacturer's app has bugs of this kind, much less ones that persist for literally years - but seems to not understand how exasperating it is to customers.

The charging data in FP is generally trash. I get that.
I’m just not sure why you quoted my post about how the charge rate is determined to make that point. It’s all good!

 

[tls]

The charging data in FP is generally trash. I get that.
I’m just not sure why you quoted my post about how the charge rate is determined to make that point. It’s all good!

Oh, yeah, that. Maybe I shouldn't post with numb fingers from the ski lift! I think I hit the "quote" button on the wrong message!

 

[TaxmanHog]

Here is another example of how the estimations and other data is unreliable, (we all agree)

Back story, Saturday afternoon, my truck was out in the cold most of the day and evening, had errands to do then host a party away from any charging facilities, temps got into the low teens, at that point the truck was well cold soaked and power out limiter was derated to 96%, Battery SOC was 78% from 85%

We got home a little after midnight, plugged in with delayed charge schedule commencing 6am, it ran, then I got up at 6:34 @10° and pushed the remote start just then and extended it intent that it be plenty warm for the Mrs. when I took her to church.

Notice the 6:34 snap shot said that I had already added 40 miles of range in only 34 minutes and that I had taken on 9.1 KWH of energy, the FCSP was pushing out almost 18 KW rate at that moment though FP said is was 16 KW, the session ran until I unplugged at 7:02, drawing a total of 17.7 KWH.

Later in the afternoon, FP posted the details of that session showing that I added 5% SOC [78 to 83%] the inferred DC stored energy is ~ 6.6 KWH [131*.05], it seems that the actual energy consumed to condition both the battery to bring up the core temp to a safe level as well as cabin warming took ~ 11.1 KWH

Est Dist Added* (55/(131*.05)) = 8.4 MPK

I made the short round trip drive after dropping her off, and returned to the garage and resumed charging the battery to get it to 85%, this took 19 minutes and 6.05 KWH, then a second abbreviated remote start of 7 minutes using 1.53 KWH as I left to pick her up and head out to breakfast,

Notice that I added back 4% for imputed 5.2 KWH of battery energy, the 26 minutes is the cumulative minutes the EVSE was sending charging energy and then later remote start energy.

Est Dist Added* (16/(131*.04)) = 3.1 MPK

The FP app should have a break-out for pre-charging conditioning energy and then charging energy, I'm assuming this is possible since we know how much energy the PTC is consuming by the second and how much is being trickled into the battery initially then later when temps are at safe minimum a higher flow to only charging and less or nil to the PTC. The data is present, we just need to have it analyzed & summarized correctly.

BTW Ford, PLEASE post the ending KWH to the close-out record we see several hours later as you've accumulated it in the active session record, yes it's potentially available in the connected charge station data but why do I have to look in multiple locations? Make a useful permanent record by adding these points of data.

[/Sunday Rant]

 

[Jim Lewis]

Where do I find the app version on an iOS device ?

If you go to the iOS App Store, as TaxmanHog suggests for Android, when you find the FordPass app, if the button option says OPEN, rather than UPDATE (or GET), you have the most current version. Tap on the app listing away from the OPEN button, and you will see app details, including the latest App Store version, which you'll have if the OPEN button was displayed.

Within the FordPass app, to see your currently installed version, tap Account, Help, then DEVICE INFORMATION button.

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