Surprise, i got sent a Ford Charge Station Pro?

[NCMike]

So let's play with those numbers.

You got home with 7% (which has nothing to do with home charging capability). You had 2 hours to charge, with your 32amp charger you got roughly 14kW, and had roughly 9kW, for a total of 23kW (18% charged).

You then drove to an EA arriving with 13% (used 5% or 6.5kW for 20 miles = 3kW per mile which seems high, but no matter).

Then you charged to 80%, adding 88kW, and got home with 33% (43kW).

So, your total usage was about 6.5kW then another 88-43 = 45kW, so you used roughly 51.5kW.

Let's assume you had an 80amp charger. In 2 hours, it would have added 240 x 80 x 90% = 17.3 x 2 = 35.6kW. You had 7% or 9kW, for a total of 44.6kW. You needed 51.5kW for your drive, so you would have had to charge anyway.

The difference here is that you had to buy 88kW, and if you had the 80amp charger you would have had to buy 6.9kW. But you still would have needed to charge at EA.

An 80amp charger does have it's fit, and yours may be a good example if you're constantly faced with arriving home empty and having to leave in 2 hours to drive a distance. That's not usual though.

I agree, I am not in the majority of users. But I am a user. That's just 1 example from this week. I can list others but no need to. To answer your original question, probably twice a month we run into the truck not charged enough for our afternoon running around with kids and we have to take the my wife's volvo. And nobody likes the volvo in this house, lol. I also hate giving EA money so any time saved there is a huge plus in my mind.

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[JRT]

Exactly, fast charging is limited in much of AL, GA, TN, and MS. In our Mach-e SR we rolled into home more then once on 10% left and while a full charge was possible overnight, a few times we switched to ICE because of range left. I have 2 200 amp breaker panels in my home already so hopefully this will not be a major upgrade. I read the manual, pretty limited information, and assume I'll need the home shut off switch to take advantage of the reverse home power option, which would be a nice upgrade for us vs the portable generator I have.

 

[RickLightning]

Exactly, fast charging is limited in much of AL, GA, TN, and MS. In our Mach-e SR we rolled into home more then once on 10% left and while a full charge was possible overnight, a few times we switched to ICE because of range left. I have 2 200 amp breaker panels in my home already so hopefully this will not be a major upgrade. I read the manual, pretty limited information, and assume I'll need the home shut off switch to take advantage of the reverse home power option, which would be a nice upgrade for us vs the portable generator I have.

You have two options as far as home power. 1) Go with the full implementation of the Ford solution. Rough cost of $9,000. 2) Put in a manual Generac switch. Cost of hundreds for the switch, plus wire and labor.

Here's what you need to think about though. How well does it automatically power your home when it's a) empty cause you just got home, or b) not at home because you're hauling the kids around or at work?

We looked at this before even buying the Lightning. Bought a whole house generator (total cost including install $10,300). Then, before getting the Lightning, we took a trip in February with the Mach-E (we would have taken the Lightning). Power went out for 2 days, we were 1,500 miles away, and would have had no automatic power due to having the truck...

You should also know that the installations of the full solution have been challenging. I know of several people that have had it bought back because it wouldn't work. One of the challenges was nearby WiFi devices, but that's in a more congested area. This is bleeding edge technology. It's not for the faint of heart.

 

[WhipSticks]

You have two options as far as home power. 1) Go with the full implementation of the Ford solution. Rough cost of $9,000. 2) Put in a manual Generac switch. Cost of hundreds for the switch, plus wire and labor.

I like the setup I have, though it was a chunk of change to get: solar PV with battery backup. When I installed the FCSP, I decided that I would not need the power backup from the truck (for the reasons you mentioned, but also because it would be a backup for my backup.) We also have 2 200 amp panels. Almost the whole house runs off of the first legacy panel, and that is the one that is backed up by the (solar-fed) Powerwalls. The second panel currently serves only two utilities: the 100 circuit to the garage for EVSE, and our geothermal heat pump for house heating and cooling. Both of those are (potentially) high-draw applications that would suck the life of the Powerwalls very quickly.
During power outages, this system allows the solar panels to continue to operate, by shunting power to the house and the batteries. Thus, even during prolonged multi-day outages, we have power. The only concern would be lack of power to the heating system in winter and the EV charging. For heat, we use wood as a backup. For the truck, we would have to drive to an offsite charger if the truck was needed or low on charge. I considered using the truck battery to back up the heating system panel in the event of a long term power outage. But that seemed to be such a rare edge case, that I could not justify the cost.

 

[bmwhitetx]

So let's play with those numbers.

Let's assume you had an 80amp charger. In 2 hours, it would have added 240 x 80 x 90% = 17.3 x 2 = 35.6kW. You had 7% or 9kW, for a total of 44.6kW. You needed 51.5kW for your drive, so you would have had to charge anyway.

Great insight as usual Rick but my engineering brain got confused by all the kW that wanted to be called kWh!

Example:
Let's assume you had an 80amp charger. In 2 hours, it would have added 240V x 80A x 90% charger efficiency = 17.3kW x 2h = 35.6kWh. You had 7% or 9kWh, for a total of 44.6kWh. You needed 51.5kWh for your drive, so you would have had to charge anyway.

Yeah I’m a nerd but I feel EV champions gotta get the terminology right. . I figure you just needed another cup of coffee this morning.

 

[Maquis]

Great insight as usual Rick but my engineering brain got confused by all the kW that wanted to be called kWh!

Example:
Let's assume you had an 80amp charger. In 2 hours, it would have added 240V x 80A x 90% charger efficiency = 17.3kW x 2h = 35.6kWh. You had 7% or 9kWh, for a total of 44.6kWh. You needed 51.5kWh for your drive, so you would have had to charge anyway.

Yeah I’m a nerd but I feel EV champions gotta get the terminology right. . I figure you just needed another cup of coffee this morning.

Look at this thread starting with about post #4.

https://www.macheforum.com/site/thr...ssues-and-one-failed-hvbjb.31280/#post-704333

 

[bmwhitetx]

Look at this thread starting with about post #4.

https://www.macheforum.com/site/thr...ssues-and-one-failed-hvbjb.31280/#post-704333

Oh my, post #1 would/did drive me insane. How do we get him to say it our way?

 

[Monkey]

The 100 amp circuit is overkill unless you are doing 200+ miles daily. I've also heard the FCSP is buggy

The biggest issue with the FCSP is the CCS connector. It's fine for any vehicle with CCS, but it's an odd connector implementation that only uses the DC pins for V2H return power. You can't use a CCS to Tesla adapter to charge a Tesla, you have to use a J1772 adapter and file down part of the adapter to make it fit. And there are no J1772 extension adapters or CCS to J1772 adapters out there so charging an older EV or many plug-in hybrids that just have J1772 is a real problem.

It's nice to have the 100A circuit and 80A charge ability if you have the electrical overhead to install it that way. Otherwise, It's much better to install a 48A EVSE (60A circuit) as there are some really excellent chargers out there now. I still recommend the new Tesla Universal Charger followed by the Emporia then ChargePoint or WallBox or Grizzl.e....

 

[Maquis]

Oh my, post #1 would/did drive me insane. How do we get him to say it our way?

We don’t. Rick will always be Rick. I mean that in a good way!
As I’ve gotten older, I realize that the less I worry about what other people are up to, the happier I am. But that doesn’t stop me from joking about it!

 

[VictorM]

The 100 amp circuit is overkill unless you are doing 200+ miles daily. I've also heard the FCSP is buggy

I use the 80a and the ”bugs” get fixed when you connect with the CS folks. Once I gave them my unit ID something changed and the apps connected and I now get Insights for best times to charge.

 

[Grease Lightning]

I am going to disagree here. While for overnight charging, a 60 amp circuit will do, there will certainly be times when you need a fast charge at home and are in a hurry to get on the road. (say the wife just drove back from somewhere and you have a meeting you need to be at an hour away. You will want the 19.2 KW charge stream to get you topped up enough to make it to work without stopping en route, or diverting out of your way to a DC fast charger out on the highway--I am absolutely not describing a real scenario that a buddy of mine might or might not have experienced). Stuff like this doesn't happen often, but when it does, you will be happy you had a 100 amp circuit at your disposal. Charge speed is the mind killer.

I can definitely see the one off situations, but in general it is overkill for most daily needs.

Shoot I currently am still only charging at 16 amps and it has worked out well for the last three months. The only day it was an issue was a turn and burn as you referenced. So I topped off at my destination while having dinner.

I almost think Ford did it backwards as the ER has that extra range it lessens the need for that high of a charge rate. For a standard range I could totally see wanting to charge above 48 amps most weekends.

As I am planning on having my charger installed soon, the part I am still contemplating is do I hardwire it for 48 amp or do the 14-50 so I can use the circuit for other things.

 

[invertedspear]

I almost think Ford did it backwards as the ER has that extra range it lessens the need for that high of a charge rate. For a standard range I could totally see wanting to charge above 48 amps most weekends.

It's part of Ford pushing the HIS with Sunrun and making our trucks batteries for our house. It's not about keeping us charged up for driving. Ford would say that's what Blue Oval Charge Network is for.

Now if only I had heard even half as many stories about the HIS working correctly as I have heard of the problems, I might have some faith I wouldn't be left in the dark. Instead I'll just run some cords from Pro-Power outlets into the house to run some necessities on.

 

[cdherman]

My $0.02

IF you already have a 50A circuit, by all means, the 40A EVSEs are quite affordable, reliable and will suffice for many if not all of us.

BUT, if you are running new wires, think on this aspect as well. Future. And not just larger vehicles or different etc. But "time of use". Evergy here in KC has one plan that is really aimed at electric vehicles -- allows charging for like $0.03/kwh. But only between 12 and 6 AM. Thats less than 60 kwh during the sweet spot at 40A. TOU is coming to everyone I suspect. Just a matter of time.

Unless your wiring run is VERY long, the savings is NOT as much as you might think running smaller wires. Again, the labor costs are going to be essentially the same.

One last trick if your run is long: Run aluminum wire to a new 125A sub-panel in your garage. 1/0 Al is cheap and totally allowable for the sub. Then run the required 3 gauge copper to the Power Pro the last few feet. You will save money and have space for a second (smaller) EVSE down the road when you or someone else has a second EV.....

 

[Newton]

Don’t play with aluminum wire unless you really know what you are doing and have the proper tools to torque it exactly right, along with the grease and all that jazz. I do a lot of stuff (and get it inspected) as a fairly knowledgeable homeowner with a lot of marine wiring experience but I would not touch aluminum after remodeling a house and seeing the scorch marks inside of the electrical panel.

 

[JRT]

Well, to install this charger is just under $5k. Needless to say I don't really need the speed as the mobile charge is doing well. I'm thinking of just installing a NEMA 14-50 male extension and using the existing 50 Amp line and set the charger for 50 Amp. Anyone done this approach?

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